would you trust those led lights

[mcrews]

Originally Posted by redpoint5

Why does the set pictured in the first link come with ballasts? LEDs don't run on thousands of volts like HID does, so it would be unnecessary..

***********not sure on the first question.
. But just so I'm clear. HIDS cost how much in lost mpg? Because my Infiniti Q45 was epa 22 hwy and I got 32 mpg hwy with minimal moods RUNNING factory HIDs.*****************

Originally Posted by redpoint5

That said, I just replaced my halogens with a cheap $40 HID kit on Amazon, and I'm very happy with the results so far. The housing was already a projector style, so the beam is very well controlled, and nobody has flashed me for blinding them. I measured the energy use at 40 watts, which only saves me 15 watts, but it still gives me much more light.

Again, 'more' light is not correct light or better light.

I am also confused. Above you say that HIDs run on 'thousands of volts' yet....as if by magic ......your's run 'at 40 watts, which only saved me 15 watts.' ??????????

1000 - 40 = 9960 saved watts...........

[j12piprius]

The two most important criteria for full spectrum lighting are the CRI (color rendering index), and the color temperature rating, measured in Kelvin degrees. The CRI rating goes from 1 to 100, the closer to 100, the more true the colors. A Kelvin rating of 5000 or higher produces more lumens (light registered by the rods of the human eye) and controls pupil size. Noon sunlight is generally around 5600 Kelvin, and 5000 Kelvin or higher light gives the appearance of substantially more light.

Halogen bulbs ~ 3200 K and 100 CRI

LED lights ~ 6000 K (posted by RedDevil) and 70 to 90+ CRI
As the lights posted by RedDevil are 6000 K, I would imagine their CRI is close to 100 as well.
I've been using LED lights in my home for years, used full spectrum before that, and the LED lights are better.

[mcrews]

Originally Posted by johnlvs2run

The two most important criteria for full spectrum lighting are the CRI (color rendering index, and the color temperature rating, measured in Kelvin degrees. The CRI rating goes from 1 to 100, the closer to 100, the more true the colors. A Kelvin rating of 5000 or higher produces a high number of Scotopic lumens (amount of light registered by the rods of the human eye and also controls pupil size). Noon sunlight is generally around 5600 Kelvin, and 5000 Kelvin or higher light vies the appearance of substantially more light.

Halogen bulbs ~ 3200 K and 100 CRI

LED lights ~ 6000 K (posted by RedDevil) and 70 to 90+ CRI
As the lights posted by RedDevil are 6000 K, I would imagine their CRI is close to 100 as well.
I've been using LED lights in my home for years, used full spectrum before that, and the LED lights are better.

Accurate and good information.........
But........
And this is REALLY important.
The housing used to reflect the light (the shiny chrome thing) in a home IS NOT regulated by the federal government for proper refraction.
THe auto headlamp is.
So two things are happening.
1. THe hot spot created by the different light sources are different AND in different spots on the bulb.
2. this is why 'more' light is not necessarily better for a car headlamp.

[mcrews]

http://i678.photobucket.com/albums/v...rt1_Page_1.jpg

if you notice in this report done by the government, 'more light' can be 20 times more than allowed by law at a particular point in front of the car.
http://i678.photobucket.com/albums/v...ers_Page_1.jpg

[RedDevil]

Originally Posted by johnlvs2run

The two most important criteria for full spectrum lighting are the CRI (color rendering index), and the color temperature rating, measured in Kelvin degrees. The CRI rating goes from 1 to 100, the closer to 100, the more true the colors. A Kelvin rating of 5000 or higher produces more lumens (light registered by the rods of the human eye) and controls pupil size. Noon sunlight is generally around 5600 Kelvin, and 5000 Kelvin or higher light gives the appearance of substantially more light.

Halogen bulbs ~ 3200 K and 100 CRI

LED lights ~ 6000 K (posted by RedDevil) and 70 to 90+ CRI
As the lights posted by RedDevil are 6000 K, I would imagine their CRI is close to 100 as well.
I've been using LED lights in my home for years, used full spectrum before that, and the LED lights are better.

The K index stands for the apparent color of the light, rather than lumen.
It is directly related to the color a black object would appear to have when heated to that specific temperature; the hotter the more the color will shift from red through the spectrum to purple..
Halogens at maybe 2800 K appear yellowish.
My 5000K HIDs appear bright white.
The 6000K LEDs appear pale white with a hint of blue.
Some 7500K LEDs I have lying around appear purplish white.
12000K HIDs are full purple. And illegal as headlights.

Now HIDS have a natural color temp of around 6400K, but the color can be altered by adding certain salts or gases. As it happens, lowering the color temp enhances the lumen per watt in HIDs; as it takes slightly less energy to release a photon in the lower (reddish) region of the spectrum than in the higher region.

White LEDs are actually blue LEDs covered with fluorescent material that converts some of the photons to a lower spectral value.
(that's why they are yellowish or orange when off and white when turned on. The yellow/orange is the fluorescent material. Scrape it off then you have blue LEDs.)
A lower color temp requires a thicker layer of fluorescent material. Inevitably some light gets lost. So LEDS lose lumen per watt if the color needs to be warmer.

As for halogen the color temperature is caused by heat; the heating of the coil.
Most of the energy is lost to heat (infrared radiation) so the higher up the spectrum, the more effective they become.
Sadly, they also will fail quicker. And the efficiency in lumen per watt will not even come close to either HIDs or LEDs.

Edit: see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Color_temperature
And the K stands for Kelvin; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kelvin

[Xist]

Originally Posted by redpoint5

LEDs don't run on thousands of volts like HID does, so it would be unnecessary.

[...]I measured the energy use at 40 watts, which only saves me 15 watts, but it still gives me much more light.

Originally Posted by mcrews

I am also confused. Above you say that HIDs run on 'thousands of volts' yet....as if by magic ......your's run 'at 40 watts, which only saved me 15 watts.' ??????????

1000 - 40 = 9960 saved watts...........

What are the amps? Aren't volts watts divided by amps, therefore not the same thing?

Or are you going to tell me that you are running one amp?

[freebeard]

I'm with mcrews, generally—excepting the maths.

I put $55 'Cree-like' LEDs in my Hella H-4 reflectors. I get more light with less power but the low-beam pattern is nowhere as sophisticated as the Hella halogens. Instead of the flat-topped half-circular low beam it's circular. I angled them down a little, because I hate driver's that don't dim their lights on approach (most people nowadays). Consequently there is more light but it isn't thrown down the road any farther.

internal fans are necessary and interfere with the rubber boot.

[redpoint5]

Originally Posted by mcrews

HIDS cost how much in lost mpg?

It isn't even measurable. Saving 30 watts with HIDs might boost MPG by 1/2 of 1%. That said, my car has a limited EV mode, and every watt saved boosts the distance I can travel on a charge. After I switch out all of my lights with LED, I might save 100 electrical watts. If we assume the alternator is 50% efficient, then I save 200 mechanical watts, or about 1/4 horsepower.

While it might take 10 years for me to recoup the cost in fuel, I benefit from higher bulb life hours, better lighting, and longer EV run time.

Again, 'more' light is not correct light or better light.

In my case, more light did equal better light. I can see much better, and the pattern and color is very useful in my ability to see at night. It's no longer an intellectual exercise for me to consider halogen vs HID on my car, because I have experienced both.

I'll agree with you that more is not always better, and that some reflectors are not good at distributing HID light properly. Today I just removed the HID kit in the Camry that has a reflector designed for a halogen. The light, while brighter, is cast all over the place and annoy oncoming drivers. Because it's cast everywhere, it doesn't improve driving visibility enough to justify their use.

I am also confused. Above you say that HIDs run on 'thousands of volts' yet....as if by magic ......your's run 'at 40 watts, which only saved me 15 watts.' ??????????

Watts = volts x amps

Voltage can be increased at the loss of amps through a transformer, which is what the HID ballast does. HIDs require an initial 25,000 volts to ignite, and afterwards requires 80 volts. For the first fraction of a second, the wattage does spike, but quickly settles down to about 40 watts.

Halogen lamps also have a spike in wattage when first started, but it isn't quite as dramatic as HID.

[RedDevil]

HIDs have a continuous discharge through ionized gas, not unlike CFL tubes.
Just like CFL you need a high voltage spark to get the gas inside the chamber ionized. Once that is done the gas conducts electricity well and only 9 Volt is needed to keep it burning.
The ballasts produce the spark to get the HIDs light up and regulate the voltage to whatever the HID needs when it is lit.

Watts are volts times amps. A 55 Watt lamp running at 12 Volt draws about 4.5 Ampere.
A 35 Watt HID draws just under 4 Ampere at 9 Volt.
During startup it will have a very short jolt at several thousand Volt, but at that voltage it will only draw milliAmps. Once the current starts flowing the voltage drops.

If the ballast just roams off the excess voltage (using a 35W HID at 9V) it will draw 4 amps at 12 Volt, wasting 12 Watt to heat, so the net gain of using HIDs would be minimal compared to halogens: 48 Watt instead of 55.
Ballasts that use a DC-DC converter could draw as little as 38 Watt, assuming 92% efficiency.

[Fat Charlie]

Originally Posted by jere

There are cars from the factory... that have LEDs I am sure these could be retro fit as well. There also many other bolt on LED options out in the form of fog lights and other auxiliary lights that come with their own housings. Ask a rally driver if those work or not.

No! No! A Thousand Times No!!

Is hacking your Toyota's filler neck to let the nozzle from a diesel pump fit in it a "diesel conversion?" No, you'd say. Fat Charlie, you're just talking craziness!

Saying "I can make it fit" and figuring out how to run power to it isn't doing the job right. You wouldn't really put one of these in your taillight just because it fits and can receive power, would you?