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View Poll Results: AMERICANS: Would you buy a 125cc motorcycle for the street?
Yes! 32 43.24%
Hell no! 18 24.32%
Yes, but only at the right price. 24 32.43%
Voters: 74. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 03-10-2018, 08:51 AM   #131 (permalink)
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295 and 357 pounds respectively. Wonderful bikes, I'm sure but just too damned heavy for my tastes. After you've ridden a flyweight anything else feels absolutely piggish.

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Old 03-10-2018, 09:52 AM   #132 (permalink)
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I had to vote hell no. You would get killed on the highway around here with an underpowered motorcycle. My bikes in order were cb 360t cb500t cb 750f yz400 (dirt bike) gs1100 v65 magna (1100) suzuki madura (1200). Notice the trend in displacement. That said, if I lived and or commuted in a city, I would consider a small bore. I couldn't go smaller than 250cc. My next bike will probably be an enduro in the 650 range like a xl650 or the kawasaki equivalent. I ride a bike for fun. I try to squeeze mileage from my truck, bikes just do it naturally. Even a litre bike with carbs can get 50 plus.

I don't think the op should be too worried about liquid cooling. Small 1 or 2 cylinder bikes do just fine with air cooling. Less weight and complications. Easy to work on too. More gears are nice but shouldn't be a show stopper if you like the bike that happens to be a 4sp. I wouldn't buy an automatic motorcycle. Fuel injection would be nice though. Never had that on a bike, but next one probably will.
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Old 03-10-2018, 07:20 PM   #133 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ctmaybury@yahoo.com View Post
I don't think the op should be too worried about liquid cooling. Small 1 or 2 cylinder bikes do just fine with air cooling.
Air-cooling is OK for a thumper or a parallel-twin, but in a V-twin it becomes a PITA. And there were 125cc V-twins at least in Europe. But anyway, since liquid cooling improves thermal management, it's not a bad idea at all. At least for the flexfuel motorcycles available here in Brazil, it would be a great improvement in order to make it easier to use ethanol year-round.
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Old 03-10-2018, 10:46 PM   #134 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sendler View Post
I can squeak out 5% better fuel economy on my 2011 Honda CBR250R than I get on my 2013 PCX150. Both are over 100 mpgUS, 42.5 km/L, 2.35L/ 100km. But most "normal riders get 75 mpg on the CBR250R and still get 100 on the PCX. I did 99.5 mpgUS for my 1,000 mile/ 23 hour trip on the CBR in bad weather. The PCX will top out at 67 mph with sliders instead of rollers. The CBR can hit 92 mph, 150 kph stock. A bit faster with longer gearing
That is good to know. Now just imagine the engine of the PCX combined with the transmission of the CBR 250. Well, that is pretty close to the CBR 125, but the scooter engines seem to be better optimized for lower rpm power.

Quote:
Originally Posted by woodsrat View Post
295 and 357 pounds respectively. Wonderful bikes, I'm sure but just too damned heavy for my tastes. After you've ridden a flyweight anything else feels absolutely piggish.
My CBR 250R has a 346 pound curb weight in its current setup. Back when I rode dirbikes, the 230ish pound CRF 250R with 35 or so horsepower sure felt powerful, at least as powerful as the 45 horsepower my CBR has. Certainly that was a factor of gearing, but man could that bike accelerate. My usual experience with street bikes is in the area of 400-500 pounds, so my CBR feels like a featherweight in comparison. The VFR 400 probably weighs around 450 pounds.

I agree that both the 125s I want could be lighter, but 300 pounds sounds pretty light to me. And lets be honest, simple mods can drop off a good bit of weight, even on these little bikes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ctmaybury@yahoo.com View Post
I had to vote hell no. You would get killed on the highway around here with an underpowered motorcycle. My bikes in order were cb 360t cb500t cb 750f yz400 (dirt bike) gs1100 v65 magna (1100) suzuki madura (1200). Notice the trend in displacement.
I have had experience with larger engined bikes(up to 800cc..), and I just don't have as much fun on them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ctmaybury@yahoo.com View Post
I don't think the op should be too worried about liquid cooling. Small 1 or 2 cylinder bikes do just fine with air cooling. Less weight and complications. Easy to work on too. More gears are nice but shouldn't be a show stopper if you like the bike that happens to be a 4sp. I wouldn't buy an automatic motorcycle. Fuel injection would be nice though. Never had that on a bike, but next one probably will.
Its not that i'm worried about the cooling, I just would much rather have liquid cooling because it allows more potential to be extracted from the engine via higher compression ratios. The CBX 1000 is air cooled, but I still want it. The dream 50 is also air cooled, yet manages to pull off a 10:1 compression ratio. Fuel injection is awesome, can't wait for the injected import bikes I want to become legal.
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Last edited by Daschicken; 03-10-2018 at 10:56 PM..
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Old 03-10-2018, 10:48 PM   #135 (permalink)
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Does anyone here know if any other Honda 125 uses a right sidecover that supports the crank in the same way it does on the Grom?

I'm of the opinion this accounts for at least a portion of it's smoothness and reliability.

Honda really did a great job on this motor.
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Old 03-11-2018, 11:28 AM   #136 (permalink)
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My CBR 250R has a 346 pound curb weight in its current setup. Back when I rode dirbikes, the 230ish pound CRF 250R with 35 or so horsepower sure felt powerful, at least as powerful as the 45 horsepower my CBR has. Certainly that was a factor of gearing, but man could that bike accelerate. My usual experience with street bikes is in the area of 400-500 pounds, so my CBR feels like a featherweight in comparison. The VFR 400 probably weighs around 450 pounds.

I agree that both the 125s I want could be lighter, but 300 pounds sounds pretty light to me. And lets be honest, simple mods can drop off a good bit of weight, even on these little bikes.

Sounds heavy to me. If I remember right my 1983 gs1100 was 520 lbs and 108hp. A 250 imo should be far less than 350. I would describe suzy as nimble not piggish. Having a passenger on the back is much easier with a bigger bike too.
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Old 03-11-2018, 11:31 AM   #137 (permalink)
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Sorry. I cut and paste a quote, but it didn't look like other quotes.
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Old 03-11-2018, 12:59 PM   #138 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ctmaybury@yahoo.com View Post
Sounds heavy to me. If I remember right my 1983 gs1100 was 520 lbs and 108hp. A 250 imo should be far less than 350. I would describe suzy as nimble not piggish. Having a passenger on the back is much easier with a bigger bike too.
Heavy? Its a fully faired 250 with FOUR CYLINDERS! The CBR 250R single cylinder has a 355 pound curb weight! My 250 also has a steel subframe, so if I could make one out of aluminum I could drop a good bit of weight.
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Best trip in V6: 52.0
Best tank in V6: 46.0
Best tank in CBR: 61.3
Best tank in VFR: 62.5
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Old 03-11-2018, 01:39 PM   #139 (permalink)
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My wife and I like to pull our travel trailer around the country. I was thinking about a scooter or smallish bike for those trips. I could put any size bike in the back of the truck, but smaller would be more convenient. I have to admit a 125 soumds like a lot of fun. 520 was the dry weight of a bike with no fairing, bags or any aftermarket accessories. All that stuff adds up fast. The bike was air cooled and had an oil cooler. Liquid colling might have added 30 lbs or so. The weight of a fairing would have been easily offset by the fuel savings on the highway. These days I much prefer to be behind a windscreen.
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Old 03-12-2018, 02:14 PM   #140 (permalink)
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Weight loss vs. horsepower...

I know I can be pretty obsessive about motorcycle weight (irritatingly so among my friends who ride "big bikes" who can't understand why I like flyweight bikes so much and won't ride bikes like they have anymore) but a vehicle's weight vs. it's power output is a very important factor in how well they perform, whether in outright performance or fuel efficiency.

I found a blog that uses basic math to show how much weight has on a vehicle's performance and wanted to share this with you:

How to Compare Weight Savings to Horsepower Gains | Tuner University

Like I said for me it's not so much about riding a 125 as it is enjoying a bike that you can throw around like a bicycle. If I could ride a 250 that weighed about the same as a currently available 125 like my K-Pipe (around 250# out the door) I'd be on it.

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