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Old 03-21-2008, 10:07 PM   #71 (permalink)
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OpenGauge SourceForge application created

I will happily transfer ownership of this administrative item to anyone who wants it. And if you collectively decide that I can't play with you under the OpenGauge banner because I want to keep and explore other options to the BasicStamp for everything approach, then I will also happily transfer control of the sourceforge project. I don't expect everyone to know everything, but as it stands now, it is wide open and there is room for a lot of different talents.


Project Name: OpenGauge

Public Description:
DIY MPG Gauges, a collection of software and hardware solutions for keeping track of your fuel consumption and miles per gallon for the Do it Yourselfer.

Registration Description:

We start with an existing, very simple, mpg monitor written in java that runs on a laptop using its sound card to monitor the fuel injection pulses and vehicle speed sensor. From there we hope to take it in a number of directions such as:

Basic stamp based stand-alone monitors
Palm/pic based monitor
More PDA/cellphone based monitors
Bluetooth connectivity
Monitors for Carbureted vehicles
Monitors for Diesel vehicles
Syncronizing fuel logs with desktops


License: GNU General Public License (GPL)


Categories:
Topic :: Games/Entertainment :: Real Time Strategy
Topic :: Software Development :: User Interfaces
Intended Audience :: by End-User Class :: Advanced End Users
Operating System :: Other Operating Systems :: Other
Operating System :: Handheld/Embedded Operating Systems :: Blackberry OS
Operating System :: Handheld/Embedded Operating Systems :: PalmOS
Programming Language :: Java
Programming Language :: C++
Programming Language :: C
Programming Language :: BASIC
Programming Language :: Assembly

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Old 03-21-2008, 10:11 PM   #72 (permalink)
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Quote:
I can say that if you want a fancy GUI the job for that will be made a lot easier with decent tools, like a graphical IDE and an emulator
In this case, and this is my opinion.... The reason why SG and MID work well is directly related to the fact that there isn't a GUI and the interface isn't fancy... Particularly useful while driving - I don't have the xGauge upgrade for SG, but I can switch over to trip fuel economy without even looking with tactile feedback... That, plus LostCause's original concern about availability of the platform (I can't buy raw components and assemble a palm after the entire unit becomes unavailable)...

Of course, what an individual does is up to the individual But collaborating is a pretty good idea for projects that intend to extend beyond the individual.
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Old 03-21-2008, 10:28 PM   #73 (permalink)
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I'm not saying palms only, nor am I saying that a standalone device is not needed.

But for the person who already has a cellphone or pda and already keeps all their info on it and just needs $10 worth of circuit and an applet to display/log the info, then why not keep an eye in that direction as well?

I do think that in the year 2008, it is ok to expect a nice user interface when using an advanced handheld device. And my comment was in response to a "nice to have" feature in a user interface.

By having seperate circuits for each vehicle type (fuel injected, diesel, carbed) that communicate in a standard fashion, it also helps keep costs down for the do it yourselfer. The freeduino display device version can plug into them too and just leave out the rs232 bit and use ttl.
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Old 03-21-2008, 11:32 PM   #74 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by diesel_john View Post
MAF description
MAF meter details
So what do you think? Will it work with a liquid or can it be made to work with a liquid?
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Old 03-22-2008, 12:56 AM   #75 (permalink)
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A simple LCD interface

I wrote a long discourse on the details, but I've deleted it and I'll summarize it with - A tiny processor, fully capable of processing VSS and injector pulses, won't handle a LCD display. It requires too many pins for communication and too much memory for LCD libraries. The options are: A bigger processor with more memory and I/O, or a LCD daughter board. The first requiring more programming, and the other more hardware.

So I figure, if someone can process the VSS and injector signals via a tiny chip, and dcb can develop the User Interface on an inexpensive Palm platform, we can come up with an cheap FE gauge for the masses. (The FE logic can always be ported to other platforms later, for more complex systems) Otherwise, we start with a powerful platform and build a LCD UI from scratch... Hmmm, dbc's suggestion for V1 is sounding cheap, fast and easy to me.

How much does a MID cost?
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Old 03-22-2008, 08:10 AM   #76 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dcb View Post
Vote? This is an all volunteer effort, you kind of have to take what you get, and you vote by rolling up your sleeves and doing something.

Note, my roadmap does not exclude the freedunio, it just makes the realistic assumption that it will take longer to develop a useable model with it. But having LOTS of programming experience, I can say that if you want a fancy GUI the job for that will be made a lot easier with decent tools, like a graphical IDE and an emulator, which I don't know if they exist for the dunio yet. But here are some screenshots for the free palm IDE and the open source OBDGauge that I'm going to be working on if anyone is interested (I deliberately misspelled "throttle" for a quick test:
Just because this is volunteer-based doesn't mean we can't concentrate our efforts. If people want to contribute, fine...but more work will get done if everyone is contributing for the same exact thing.

If we have one guy working on the Palm, another on the *duino, another on a 3 digit LCD, another w/ PIC's, another with BASIC Stamps...we could each be brilliant and yet go nowhere.

As you seem pretty set on the Palm, as do others, lets work with the Palm...

I think we all know my stance already: one extra component, unnecessarily complex, limited availability. However, I don't have the experience or know-how to fully stand behind my argument so I'm fine with switching. All I really care about is something useful actually being created...

If we can't agree, this will stay a one to two-man show. Volunteer doesn't mean take what you can get, it means give what you can. If we have clearly defined goals, then people can contribute as much as they wish.

Until then, I'll stand on the sidelines with interest.

Quote:
Originally Posted by s2man View Post
How much does a MID cost?
In the $150 range, I think.

- LostCause

Last edited by LostCause; 03-22-2008 at 08:15 AM..
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Old 03-22-2008, 08:39 AM   #77 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LostCause View Post
work will get done if everyone is contributing for the same exact thing.
Agreed, but apparently not going to happen. A herd of cats comes to mind . And it seems that, so far, the people with the most experience/skills/ability are least interested in the *duino route.

Quote:
As you seem pretty set on the Palm, as do others, lets work with the Palm...
I agree with this, but not to the abandoning of other approaches. For lots of reasons already mentioned in this thread, I prefer the *duino/LCD standalone route, and I want to pursue that as well.

I have a feeling that it will be easier for a rank novice developer (eg. me) to eventually make a working MPGuino than to develop the circuitry, interface & code for a Palm based gauge.

That said, I'd like to participate in/follow/possibly contribute to the Palm approach, since the person with the most experience wants to take that route.

I think we should probably start a new thread about it. E.G. to start with, those of us without Palms, will need advice on what to look for/avoid to buy one that will work with this project. (I don't have one/never used one.)

Re: MID prices:

Quote:
In the $150 range, I think.
The cost is currently 20,000 JP Yen. It used to be in around $160 USD but the US currency slide has complicated things. Currently it works out to $200.81 USD.
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Old 03-22-2008, 09:04 AM   #78 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MetroMPG View Post
I agree with this, but not to the abandoning of other approaches. For lots of reasons already mentioned in this thread, I prefer the *duino/LCD standalone route, and I want to pursue that as well.

I have a feeling that it will be easier for a rank novice developer (eg. me) to eventually make a working MPGuino than to develop the circuitry, interface & code for a Palm based gauge.

That said, I'd like to participate in/follow/possibly contribute to the Palm approach, since the person with the most experience wants to take that route.

I think we should probably start a new thread about it. E.G. to start with, those of us without Palms, will need advice on what to look for/avoid to buy one that will work with this project. (I don't have one/never used one.)
The voice of reason...

I suppose the majority of what is learned will translate over anyways. I've already learned techniques for getting signals (zener diode, etc.) that I had never thought of so I don't mind tagging along.

Quote:
Re: MID prices:

The cost is currently 20,000 JP Yen. It used to be in around $160 USD but the US currency slide has complicated things. Currently it works out to $200.81 USD.
We poh...

- LostCause
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Old 03-22-2008, 10:05 AM   #79 (permalink)
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Good Morning Gentlemen,
Ive been following this thread with interest.
I know less than nothing about computers, programming, building hardware, etc.
This is why I've kept quiet so far.
I echo MetroMPG
I would need to know what to look for in a Palm or Blackberry or other handheld device. I've never used or owned one either.
I would also need detailed instructions and circuit diagrams for the ancillary/accessory devices.
I am a skilled Auto Tech.
I can build anything when I have instructions
I can show you how to find the signal wires on the vehicle in question
I can't write code or program anything
I will sit and wait for your guidance.
I have several vehicles that are too old for the SG
I have no clue what a 'duino or zener diode is, but I'm looking it up right now.
I've never hacked a computer. I have however completely re-wired a new car that suffered severe fire damage
I can solder and weld anything.
Show me where to go and what to build.
Please.
Thank You,
Schultz.
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Old 03-22-2008, 10:09 AM   #80 (permalink)
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I'm sorry, when I say basic stamp, I'm thinking of the *dunio, that is not technically accurate. I'll calm down once we get something that works, I promise.

LostCause, or metroschultz? can I ask you to do some analysis of the following? I'd like to get a handle on how much potential there is for these devices and maybe we can focus on where the need is, and blow our own horn a bit:
1. How many vehicles on the road are 1996 and newer?
2. How many vehicles on the road have electronic fuel injection but are pre '96?
3. How many vehicles on the road are Carbureted
4. How many vehicles on the road are Diesel?
Vehicles can be cars, trucks, semis, motorcycles, etc. US numbers are probably easiest to get but the world picture would be nice too.

Note, you don't have to buy a palm for developing the fuel injection interface, someone can just convert the java laptop thingie to use the same serial port protocol as the palm is planning on. Heck, use the dunio to write the fuel injection interface circuit, if no one comes up with a cheap pic version it might be all we have for starters. If someone does step up to the cheap pic/circuit version then you can focus on the dunio user interface if you like.

Coyote? S2? Can you gentlemen agree to sort out a low cost vehicle injector/vss monitor to rs232 circuit? Here is the el cheapo programmer I ordered: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=310032761189 but I'm not married to it. It mentions some free programming utilities, etc. Should work with the following microchip pics:
PIC12F629 Flash 8-pin 1kb 20MHz Microcontroller http://www.futurlec.com/Microchip/PIC12F629.shtml
PIC12F635 Flash 8-pin 1kb 8MHz Microcontroller
PIC12F675 Flash 8-Pin 1kb 20MHz Microcontroller with A/D
PIC12F683 Flash 8-Pin 2kb 8MHz Microcontroller with A/D
PIC16F636
PIC16F639
PIC16F684 Flash 14-pin 3.5kB Microcontroller with PWM (might be fun for an analog mpg gauge)
PIC16F685
PIC16F687
PIC16F688
PIC16F689
PIC16F690 Flash 20-pin 4kB Microcontroller
PIC18Fx6x0
PIC18Fx550

Also for fun, I discovered and played with the preferences screen last night, it supports six languages! I added a selection for OpenGauge setup I don't think I want to fight the layout management in obd gauge very much, basically I am planning on adding "computed" rows that you can add or delete from various pages, i.e.: Instant MPG, tank MPG, current MPG and maybe set it up so you can get 8 items on one screen.


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