Aptera Reboot - Improved

[Isaac Zachary]

Originally Posted by freebeard

An Arcimoto FUV with the Ecoflow Delta Pro solar charging system would come close.

Seeing how I already have to drive to and from work in weather that's already at freezing temps this early in the year I don't think an open body design would be all that appealing to me. My outdoor thermometer said it was 24⁰F last morning.

[oil pan 4]

Hey I work with a guy who lived in Gunnison CO, he always talks about how cold it is.

[Accordowner]

Aptera is not necessarily the best design for an ultra efficient, lightweight and functional vehicle we have seen come and then vaporize! Some years back we had the Volkswagen L1 and its successor XL1. These cars were astonishingly efficient, functional but not so outlandishly large and weird looking as this Aptera. In the case of XL1 it was a planned vaporware because it was priced at around $150,000! Reason being; they had to use lots of exotic and expensive material like carbon fiber throughout! This was done to make the vehicle lightweight. But this was obviously a BS made up for the lay public who have no knowledge of the fact that subtle weight savings play a very small part in improving efficiency!

[Isaac Zachary]

Originally Posted by Accordowner

Aptera is not necessarily the best design for an ultra efficient, lightweight and functional vehicle we have seen come and then vaporize! Some years back we had the Volkswagen L1 and its successor XL1. These cars were astonishingly efficient, functional but not so outlandishly large and weird looking as this Aptera. In the case of XL1 it was a planned vaporware because it was priced at around $150,000! Reason being; they had to use lots of exotic and expensive material like carbon fiber throughout! This was done to make the vehicle lightweight. But this was obviously a BS made up for the lay public who have no knowledge of the fact that subtle weight savings play a very small part in improving efficiency!

Do you have a better production vehicle that's both ultra efficient, functional and affordable?

The thing with weight savings and aerodynamic drag is that in the begining these didn't play much of a part in efficiency because engines used to be so inefficient. But now that we're getting closer to 90% efficiencies in EV's the only way to improve efficiency will be through aerodynamic drag and rolling resistance improvements.

Of course the other way of thinking is that with engines and motors being so efficient, who cares if the vehicle is a rolling wind brick.

[Accordowner]

Originally Posted by Isaac Zachary

Do you have a better production vehicle that's both ultra efficient, functional and affordable?

The thing with weight savings and aerodynamic drag is that in the beginning these didn't play much of a part in efficiency because engines used to be so inefficient. But now that we're getting closer to 90% efficiencies in EV's the only way to improve efficiency will be through aerodynamic drag and rolling resistance improvements.

Of course the other way of thinking is that with engines and motors being so efficient, who cares if the vehicle is a rolling wind brick.

Why are you mixing all those characteristics together? I didn't say that aerodynamics does not play a role in vehicle efficiency. On the contrary, It is the biggest component at high speeds! Weight does play a role in efficiency but the difference in weight between conventionally affordable materials like aluminum and the exotics and expensive carbon fiber is negligible!

As far as motor efficiency, we haven't made any noticeable inroads since the advent of AC induction motors back in 1887!

[Isaac Zachary]

Originally Posted by Accordowner

Why are you mixing all those characteristics together? I didn't say that aerodynamics does not play a role in vehicle efficiency. On the contrary, It is the biggest component at high speeds! Weight does play a role in efficiency but the difference in weight between conventionally affordable materials like aluminum and the exotics and expensive carbon fiber is negligible!

As far as motor efficiency, we haven't made any noticeable difference since the advent of AC induction motors back in 1887!

With vehicles bloating in weight to the point that at highway speeds rolling resistance is nearly half the energy loss, I'd say that weight (rolling resistance) is probably something we should be paying more attention to even if generally aerodynamic drag is a bit more of a drag.

[Accordowner]

Originally Posted by Isaac Zachary

With vehicles bloating in weight to the point that at highway speeds rolling resistance is nearly half the energy loss, I'd say that weight (rolling resistance) is probably something we should be paying more attention to even if generally aerodynamic drag is a bit more of a drag.

Sure. Whatever you say!

[Isaac Zachary]

Originally Posted by Accordowner

But this was obviously a BS made up for the lay public who have no knowledge of the fact that subtle weight savings play a very small part in improving efficiency!

Originally Posted by Accordowner

Sure. Whatever you say!

Subtle weight savings aren't going to help much if by subtle you mean little. But big weight savings are going to help a lot.

Here's a diagram attached showing how much is lost to aerodynamic drag and rolling resistance in a Tesla Model 3. It is from this video from Engineering Explained. Note how at around 55mph, both rolling resistance and aerodynamic drag are about the same.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jKm-CtIaIRw

[freebeard]

Originally Posted by Isaac Zachary

Of course the other way of thinking is that with engines and motors being so efficient, who cares if the vehicle is a rolling wind brick.

Use case. Opposite to the Aptera is the Xbus. The squared off top front edge maximizes solar exposure. Not a problem if you in no hurry.

[Accordowner]

Originally Posted by Isaac Zachary

Subtle weight savings aren't going to help much if by subtle you mean little. But big weight savings are going to help a lot.

Here's a diagram attached showing how much is lost to aerodynamic drag and rolling resistance in a Tesla Model 3. It is from this video from Engineering Explained. Note how at around 55mph, both rolling resistance and aerodynamic drag are about the same.

Why do people keep referencing this douche's videos as authoritative source of engineering knowledge!!?? In one of his videos, this dope says that putting an ICE car in neutral while driving is bad for the car!!!???