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Old 01-17-2020, 09:33 PM   #381 (permalink)
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Any savings from paint will get eaten by that bulletproof glass.

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Old 01-18-2020, 02:32 PM   #382 (permalink)
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cost to paint

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hersbird View Post
I have trouble buying the paint process is all that expensive. It really doesn't cost more to paint a $12,000 car vs a $60,000 car yet a $60,000 car easily could have a $12,000 powertrain in it. If the paint process costs more than the powertrain on said car then painting a $12,000 car would cost more than $12,000.

Also if say $5-10k could be saved per car by not painting somebody would have done that in large numbers long ago. Also even with say stainless steel, some of those corrosion steps are still going to be needed as stainless isn't corrosion proof on it's own and what about all the metal under the stainless, is it also stainless? Just the material cost of using stainless rather than mild steel is going to be similar to the painting cost IMO. It's a wash.
When that article was published,the average new car price was $17,000.Painting costs shared would be germane to that price point at the time.
The Hyundai TV program may have originally aired around 2009 or so.When they throw Roman Numerals around in the end credits,it's a nightmare dating a program.
Junior's Color Service,in Southern California, used to charge $50,000 for a hand-rubbed lacquer paint job,including body straightening.I have no idea what high-end products incorporate into their offerings.I can't afford the trade rags anymore.
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Old 01-18-2020, 05:06 PM   #383 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by rmay635703 View Post
Paint is very expensive,

On small parts paint and finish can easily cost more than the “bare” part

Where I work we are converting a lot of small pieces to stainless because it is much cheaper than the coating+ standard steel

That is not my experience. I talked to the guys in charge of quoting our metal parts and they sent me the quoting formula. The largest cost is raw material, followed by labor (direct and indirect combined) and then finishing. Our stainless and polished aluminum parts are much more expensive than our painted steel parts.

I also asked the manager in charge of all of our paint processes how much it costs to paint a vehicle. He said about $600
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Old 01-18-2020, 08:15 PM   #384 (permalink)
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Quote:
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Any savings from paint will get eaten by that bulletproof glass.
Any cost associated with the fancy glass will be saved by making it flat.

In an exoskeleton glass is 100% structural. We're talking about massive loads that are going through that glass roof. The glass is cross-bracing the main truss.

It's not like the engineers woke up one day and thought 'Let's needlessly add cost and weight for a feature nobody wants. It will reduce performance and range but we'll do it anyway'.

I've soundproofed a few vehicles now and what you end up with is all the sound coming in through the glass. With that weak point fixed the CT should be completely silent. Even more so if they incorporate their new patent for thermo-accoustic glass.

Nobody no the whole interwebs seems to have noticed that this is a pillarless pick up, probably the first since the Model T. That's another stroke of genius (I have two pillarless cars - love pillarless) - you don't have to stamp window frames or create a seal from the window to frame then frame to body. Window frames aren't structural so they're really just dead weight. Thicker glass possibly makes a more effective seal.

Things like rubber seals are fiddly and presently installed by humans. Minimal parts count = minimal cost. I have no doubt once the CT is reverse engineered we'll see a lot of 'ah-ha' moments.

It may not be a Lotus, but they've certainly nailed the 'simplify' part of 'Simplify then add lightness'.
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Old 01-18-2020, 10:14 PM   #385 (permalink)
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Quote:
Quote:
Any savings from paint will get eaten by that bulletproof glass.
Any cost associated with the fancy glass will be saved by making it flat.
Truthfully, I have no knowledge about the material cost. Beetle owners know about the advantages of flat glass.

They've specced the same glass in the Semi and it has curved windows.

Agreed, the best part is no part.
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Old 01-19-2020, 12:27 AM   #386 (permalink)
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I paid $20 to replace the glass in my bug after my friend accidentally stabbed his knife through it. Cheep indeed. Everything was cheap on that car $20 seemed to be a standard price for components.
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Old 01-19-2020, 12:47 AM   #387 (permalink)
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Based on this analysis by Hyperchange, the new manufacturing techniques introduced for the Model Y can be rolled into the Cybertruck.

Lighter, simplified cabling designed to be installed by robots.

The cast single-piece body might be a problem.

edit: No sooner did I post, than I found this:
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Old 01-19-2020, 07:07 PM   #388 (permalink)
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There is little to be learned from doing the same thing over again while trying to optimize the processes involved. The processes might get better, but there's little to gain.

There's a lot to be learned from going radically different.
Even if the Cybertruck would not be the success Tesla hopes it to be, what they've learned will put them ahead of anyone else, or further ahead than today for that matter.
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Old 01-19-2020, 08:07 PM   #389 (permalink)
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Tesla is bringing aerospace technology to a market that has resisted it.

Here's a problem:



Who gets a hot hatch? China. Who isn't bringing the ID.3 to the USofA? Volkswagen.
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Old 01-20-2020, 12:16 AM   #390 (permalink)
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Even if Tesla's cost for materials and spreading the cost over a million cars (which they have not made yet) it comes to a $1000 each, that still does not account for all the TIME taken to let the paint dry/bake... and then again for the clear... That time has to be a huge delay when if you could skip it and with no other savings, the savings would be getting cars out faster.

Tesla does not have cars sitting in dealer lots (where most other cars are just picked from what is available). Tesla customers predominantly get their cars to order, so delays in manufacturing means delay in getting paid for all the material just spent to build that car.

Is that delay waiting for paint offset the additional cost for the stainless steel outerbody/frame? We will see in a couple of years.

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