11-15-2017, 01:16 PM
|
#521 (permalink)
|
Master EcoModder
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Maynard, MA Eaarth
Posts: 7,907
Thanks: 3,475
Thanked 2,950 Times in 1,844 Posts
|
The sun's output has been unexpectedly low, for a while now. We have seen significant warming despite the lower output from the sun.
The numbers I have been seeing are that a bit less than 60% of voters feel that climate change is a big issue. Given that there are actual flat earthers here in the US, that makes it more significant that climate change is recognized as an important issue.
BBC NEWS | UK | Magazine | Do they really think the earth is flat?
|
|
|
The Following User Says Thank You to NeilBlanchard For This Useful Post:
|
|
Today
|
|
|
Other popular topics in this forum...
|
|
|
11-15-2017, 02:03 PM
|
#522 (permalink)
|
Corporate imperialist
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: NewMexico (USA)
Posts: 11,266
Thanks: 273
Thanked 3,569 Times in 2,833 Posts
|
That less than 20% number doesn't mean only 20% of people care about the environment. That means only 20% have bought into the man made global warming mass hysteria.
Around 2/3 of people think climate change, both natural and man made is an important issue. I agree climate change could easily kill off 95% of the population. The last ice age may have killed off up to 99% of humans.
Just in recorded history climate change has caused wars, famine, mass migration. Climate change could have created the concept of warfare it's self.
The total irradiance of the sun has increased 0.1% to 0.05% from maunder minimum to present.
So we are talking the difference of around 1 watt per square meter.
__________________
1984 chevy suburban, custom made 6.5L diesel turbocharged with a Garrett T76 and Holset HE351VE, 22:1 compression 13psi of intercooled boost.
1989 firebird mostly stock. Aside from the 6-speed manual trans, corvette gen 5 front brakes, 1LE drive shaft, 4th Gen disc brake fbody rear end.
2011 leaf SL, white, portable 240v CHAdeMO, trailer hitch, new batt as of 2014.
Last edited by oil pan 4; 11-15-2017 at 03:22 PM..
|
|
|
11-15-2017, 02:07 PM
|
#523 (permalink)
|
Master EcoModder
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: northwest of normal
Posts: 28,544
Thanks: 8,086
Thanked 8,878 Times in 7,327 Posts
|
NeilBlanchard — Unexpectedly?
The Current Solar Minimum and Its Consequences for Climate - Evidence-Based Climate Science - Chapter 11
Quote:
Summary
The current solar minimum, named here the Eddy Minimum, is a de Vries Cycle event expected to consist of Solar Cycles 24 and 25. It arrived on schedule at 210 years after the start of the last major minimum, the Dalton Minimum from 1798. Work by Fix (this volume) suggests that this minimum will be two solar cycles long.
|
Solar cycles are 11 years long.
edit:
Quote:
Originally Posted by oil pan 4
Around 2/3 of people think climate change, both natural and man made is an important issue. I agree climate change could easily kill off 95% of the population. The last ice age may have killed off up to 99% of humans.
|
If we can engineer the technology to live on Mars, we can engineer the technology to live on an Ice Age Earth.
Thus it comes down to willingness to share the technology with the 95% of humanity that is focused on pets, sports and religion.
Last edited by freebeard; 11-15-2017 at 03:10 PM..
|
|
|
11-15-2017, 06:35 PM
|
#524 (permalink)
|
Not Doug
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Show Low, AZ
Posts: 12,232
Thanks: 7,254
Thanked 2,231 Times in 1,721 Posts
|
Dog racing is my religion.
Can we survive on Venus? That is we are going if we do not put seaweed in our chili!
|
|
|
The Following User Says Thank You to Xist For This Useful Post:
|
|
11-15-2017, 08:26 PM
|
#525 (permalink)
|
Human Environmentalist
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Oregon
Posts: 12,750
Thanks: 4,316
Thanked 4,471 Times in 3,436 Posts
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilBlanchard
The numbers I have been seeing are that a bit less than 60% of voters feel that climate change is a big issue.
|
Even 50% is a surprising number to me.
It's not that climate change isn't a big issue, it's that I can readily list 10 things that more drastically affect human health and wellness that are more immediate than climate change. The list of 10 things is what I can come up with given no thought to what harms people. The list would have 50 things ahead of climate change if I gave 30 minutes of thought to it.
... and then there is the whole problem of having no reasonable way to stop climate change.
Ask a 100 year old person what are the 10 worst things they experienced in their lifetime. I'd be surprised if climate change makes the list. The next 100 years is supposed to experience about the same amount of change as the previous 100 years.
Last edited by redpoint5; 11-16-2017 at 12:46 AM..
|
|
|
11-15-2017, 08:51 PM
|
#526 (permalink)
|
Corporate imperialist
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: NewMexico (USA)
Posts: 11,266
Thanks: 273
Thanked 3,569 Times in 2,833 Posts
|
Yeah a CME completely destroying most of the world's power grids.
But most people outside of new Zealand or the north east united States have any idea that solar activity can knock out power.
__________________
1984 chevy suburban, custom made 6.5L diesel turbocharged with a Garrett T76 and Holset HE351VE, 22:1 compression 13psi of intercooled boost.
1989 firebird mostly stock. Aside from the 6-speed manual trans, corvette gen 5 front brakes, 1LE drive shaft, 4th Gen disc brake fbody rear end.
2011 leaf SL, white, portable 240v CHAdeMO, trailer hitch, new batt as of 2014.
|
|
|
11-15-2017, 10:50 PM
|
#527 (permalink)
|
Master EcoModder
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Philippines
Posts: 2,173
Thanks: 1,739
Thanked 589 Times in 401 Posts
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by rmay635703
Why then do hunter gathering societies typically regulate their population to a steady number over centuries.
And no it’s not the “environment “ that does it.
|
Infant mortality, diseases, lack of resources, lack of protein sources (mhm... cannibalism)
-
Of course, we're not hunter gatherers. Hunter gatherer societies are societies in stasis, with no growth. But not always due to design.
There's a reason the number of young people willing to stay inside these tribes dwindles to nothing once they've been exposed to modern life.
We're modern humans who've grown up with the idea of continuous growth. But we still retain the same feast-or-famine instincts as our forebearers. Consume as much as possible now, in case you catch nothing on tomorrow's hunt.
Which is also why so many modern humans are obese.
We are biologically driven to consume to survive. Our instincts are of no help in terms of conservation. Conservation has to be taught.
Quote:
Originally Posted by freebeard
If we can engineer the technology to live on Mars, we can engineer the technology to live on an Ice Age Earth.
Thus it comes down to willingness to share the technology with the 95% of humanity that is focused on pets, sports and religion.
|
Technically, we can engineer almost anything, given infinite time and resources.
Obviously, we don't have that much. So it comes down to how much we can do.
|
|
|
11-16-2017, 02:11 AM
|
#528 (permalink)
|
Master EcoModder
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: northwest of normal
Posts: 28,544
Thanks: 8,086
Thanked 8,878 Times in 7,327 Posts
|
Quote:
Dog racing is my religion.
Can we survive on Venus?
|
You managed to roll those three up very well.
Surprisingly, Venus is possibly the most hospitable extraterrestrial
place. ...50 miles up in the atmosphere. Similar gravity and air pressure, just no oxygen.
Steampunk dirigibles, anyone?
|
|
|
The Following User Says Thank You to freebeard For This Useful Post:
|
|
11-16-2017, 01:40 PM
|
#529 (permalink)
|
Master EcoModder
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Maynard, MA Eaarth
Posts: 7,907
Thanks: 3,475
Thanked 2,950 Times in 1,844 Posts
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by freebeard
|
I am not just talking about the 11 / 22 year cycle of sun spots. The sun is expected to increase over time (like all midsized stars) and it has had a drop off from that long term trend. It is lower output than it "could" be.
Last edited by NeilBlanchard; 11-16-2017 at 01:47 PM..
Reason: quoted the point I was responding to
|
|
|
11-16-2017, 01:45 PM
|
#530 (permalink)
|
Master EcoModder
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Maynard, MA Eaarth
Posts: 7,907
Thanks: 3,475
Thanked 2,950 Times in 1,844 Posts
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by oil pan 4
That less than 20% number doesn't mean only 20% of people care about the environment. That means only 20% have bought into the man made global warming mass hysteria.
|
Hysteria? That doesn't describe science, and it doesn't describe what we know.
It does describe your opinion - but your opinion about facts doesn't change them.
|
|
|
|