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Old 05-16-2008, 04:14 PM   #21 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoJotheTireMan View Post
I was referring to hills on our highways, speed limit back then was 55mph and barely pulling off 45mph over some hills was nerve racking back then, never mind now that the speed limit is 65mph and it seems, around here at least, that the majority are going 75+mph. I didn't think it was overly economical to hold the peddle to the floor in 3rd gear all the way up the larger hills, and that was with all 4 cylinders.
Cut that down to 2 and I would think you would find some hills that you just can't climb, you may but I wouldn't want any part in trying to lug up a hill on the highway going 20-30mph as the whirr of 75+mph traffic goes screaming by. Just doesn't seem to pay off, risk vs reward.

I am all for economy, but done safely.
I mean, if your not worried about going too slow on the highway, then why not ride a moped at 35-40mph and get 100+mpg, no?
Sure, but I am not too sure that you would live long enough to see the potential fuel savings, well in my neck of the woods at least, out in the country it may be less crowded, but around here the roads are crazy, chuck full of speeding massholes who all seem to be in such a hurry to race up to the next red light or stop sign.

Best of luck with your car. JoJoTheTireMan
Mopeds are not legal on freeways here but perfectly legal on secondary roads.
Here if your going below 45 MPH your required to put on your emergency flashers. and usually there is a truck going slow up the hills. If i am streamlined i can gain more going down than the trucks can. I just pick the truck that has about the same power to weight as i do, to run with. Any time you are running full rack on a diesel and converting all that power into potenial energy you are being efficient no matter what gear and then coast down the next hill for free.The slower your speed up the hill the greater percentage is being stored in the mass of your vehicle and the less lost to push the air.
I have noticed people driving a lot slower the last few days. i think it's starting to hurt the imbeciles with 7 ladders on top of their truck arranged in the most aero inefficient manner possible, driving at 70 mph in a 60 zone. When you can make more money per hour by slowing down than rushing to the job site, then you will see traffic really slowing down. People don't know how little their time is really worth. Keep in mind if you slow down to the speed limit, everyone behind you is saving money also. I am finding people just don't want to be the first one, but once someone is going slow then they follow contently for miles. There will always be some who need a 2 X 4 up side the head to get their attention but their wallets are starting to smoke.
I have found reman. heads for the 1.6L soon to be 0.8L VW diesel for $400. Is that too much?


Last edited by diesel_john; 05-26-2008 at 03:05 PM..
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Old 05-16-2008, 05:31 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by diesel_john View Post
Mopeds are not legal on freeways here but perfectly legal on secondary roads.
Here if your going below 45 MPH your required to put on your emergency flashers. and usually there is a truck going slow up the hills. If i am streamlined i can gain more going down than the trucks can. I just pick the truck that has about the same power to weight as i do, to run with. Any time you are running full rack on a diesel and converting all that power into potenial energy you are being efficient no matter what gear and then coast down the next hill for free.The slower your speed up the hill the greater percentage is being stored in the mass of your vehicle and the less lost to push the air.
I have noticed people driving a lot slower the last few days. i think it's starting to hurt the imbeciles with 7 ladders on top of their truck arranged in the most aero inefficient manner possible, driving at 70 mph in a 60 zone. When you can make more money per hour by slowing down than rushing to the job site, then you will see traffic really slowing down. People don't know how little their time is really worth. Keep in mind if you slow down to the speed limit, everyone behind you is saving money also. I am finding people just don't want to be the first one, but once someone is going slow then they follow contently for miles. There will always be some who need a 2 X 4 up side the head to get their attention but their wallets are starting to smoke.
I have found reman. heads for the 1.6L soon to be 0.8L VW diesel for $400. Is that too much?
Indeed, the moped thing was more of a joke, but you get the idea.
I hope you can drive a .8L NA diesel and not get killed and/or run off the road. Best of luck, really.
I too have noticed that there are a lot more people driving the speed limit on the highways these days, and your right it is just recently, maybe it was the $3.50/gallon mark or something, who knows, but it's about time.
If everyone else slows down, then it will lower our demand for fuels, and in turn lower the price.....yeah I know wishfull thinking more than anything.
Really wierd part of the time argument is this, I go 110 miles round trip every day. I used to hammer along at 85+ the whole way (and I got 30 mpg doing it) and my best times ever were just under an hour.
Now, I have slowed down to 70mph max, usually 65ish, and I am EOCing any hill that is big enough to not lose much speed on, restarts at 60mph, pulse at top of hill before shutdown is max of 75mph. I just got 37.5mpg on my last tank this way. Not too bad as my car is EPA rated at 21/29.
All that said, and my typical time to commute to work and back, still just about an hour on the button, I don't even notice any extra time, so you are 1000% right, just not worth it to be in such a hurry these days.
Absolutely no clue how much you should pay for a reman diesel VW head, just haven't bought anything for a VW diesel since the early 90s.
I got stranded twice in cold weather with a tank full of jello, and hence have not owned a diesel since.
Also to note, gas was $.99/gallon and diesel was $.79/gallon back then, now those were the days to own a 50mpg diesel rabbit :-)
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Old 05-16-2008, 11:13 PM   #23 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoJotheTireMan View Post
I agree with all your input on forced induction characteristics, but my real quetion is this:
which would be more efficient for a commuter car
a NA 4 banger 2.0L
or a supercharged 1.0L?
Loaded question. You can manifest most anything if you have the cubic dollars to spend. I've tuned 750 whp two liter engines that net 0.39 bsfc, which is better than any mill currently put out by the OEMs that I am aware of.

That being said it's going to be much easier to make your 2 liter fuel efficient than any FI car that will require boost to pull the vehicle up even mild hills. There is a lot to be said for the KISS principle. I take on a lot of odd projects, but I wouldn't even attempt yours for practical reasons. Better to spend your money de-stroking your engine or the like, would result in a more reliable and less expensive solution.



Quote:
Originally Posted by JoJotheTireMan View Post
You said:
"You make less power than if the engine was kept stock, since less than 2 time 1/2 the engine does not equal 1."

I agree, and that is the point here. I am only out to make slightly more power than 1/2 the engine would make.
I am not after a net gain here, I am after a net loss!
Less HP/TQ will require less fuel to achieve, no?
Probably not. FI cars like to run rich for combustion chamber cooling reasons, between the loss of pumping efficiency and richer mixtures under boost - which you WILL have to hit due to the lower power level of the setup -you will net a power and FE loss.
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Old 05-16-2008, 11:33 PM   #24 (permalink)
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JoJoTheTireMan, veggie oil is ten times worst in cold weather than petro-diesel.


Joseph Davis,
How does this number compare to your .39 BFSC number?
18.65 Hp.-hr./Gallon of diesel.
http://www.deere.com/en_US/newsroom/...430trfuel.html
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Old 05-17-2008, 12:06 AM   #25 (permalink)
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Turtle Gee and all this time I thought FI was for FE(Precise Control)

Most FI cars out there are trying to run in the 14.7/1 range all the time.
The only time they go rich is during WOT.
If you live at WOT then you may not be looking for FE any way.
I believe the idea has merit and would like to see some one here make a valid attempt. Thank You DieselJohn & JoJo.
FYI, I ran a 318 V8 Dodge for 10 months on 6 cyl because I (stupidly) blew the head (Not gasket) between 2 adjacent cyls.
It was FI and I disconnected the fuel injectors and grounded the plug leads to those cyl's until I had the money to repair the beast.
This was before I became interested in FE so I have no clue what the MPG was.
It did run (not smooth) and I used it for work and hauling engines & transmissions up the road forever.
I fixed it and then sold it(needed money)
For this example alone I believe their idea will work.
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Old 05-17-2008, 12:25 AM   #26 (permalink)
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I could keep a couple gallons of propane in the bottle, just in case 0.8 L isn't enough in an emergency. Don't want to put the new head in orbit though. Combustion pressures tend to get kinda high when i start lighting fires with the piston half way up.
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Old 05-17-2008, 02:46 AM   #27 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoJotheTireMan View Post
Gearing, yes I do have an 020, and I already have a .715:1 TDI 5th gear machined with the groove so it works in my trans. .75:1 was also an option over my stock .80:1.

You know of any 5th gear sets taller than those?
You're probably going to need a taller wheel/tire combo, what're ratios/tire size now?
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Old 05-19-2008, 09:33 AM   #28 (permalink)
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JoJoTheTireMan, veggie oil is ten times worst in cold weather than petro-diesel.
I realize this, I had diesel from the pumps freeze up on me. The veggie oil kits all have to preheat the oil before you can switch over to it, which is fine on long commutes. It would work great for me, but not cost effective seeing how much diesel is these days and seeing how much the VW TDIs sell for these days. If I find a good deal on a TDI then I will probably go this route, utill then I will just try to get the best I can from what I already own as that is the cheapest solution in the short term.
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Old 05-19-2008, 09:36 AM   #29 (permalink)
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You're probably going to need a taller wheel/tire combo, what're ratios/tire size now?
I am running 195/60R14s and the other size recomended for my car is 185/60R14. Not sure what the R&P ratio is off the top of my head, but I do know that there are not too many R&Ps out there any taller than what I have as a starting point.
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Old 05-19-2008, 12:55 PM   #30 (permalink)
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I have a suggestion. Don't use the extra two cylinders as a supercharger. I think that would reduce your fuel economy, shorten the engine life and give you lots of shaking at low RPM. I've tried running my Accord on two cylinders and it shook a lot when it ran at less than 2000 RPM. My front exhaust pipe cracked and my flex pipe developed a leak. At highway speeds it ran smoothly and had enough power to maintain speed up most hills.

For smoother operation and better fuel economy you could try using the two deactivated cylinders to expand the exhaust gas more before releasing it into the exhaust pipe. At full throttle, the pressure of the burned gases should be about 30 PSI above atmospheric pressure at the end of a power stroke. Sending that gas to two cylinders for expansion to double the volume before release will recover extra energy without using more fuel. If you pump a little water in the passage to the expansion cylinders, you may get some extra pressure by making steam.

When the load on the engine is small, it might be better to release the exhaust gas from the operational cylinders directly into the exhaust pipe. It won't do any good to expand the gasses until there is a vacuum. That would waste power. One way to solve that problem is to use one way valves between the exhaust valves of the expansion cylinders and the exhaust pipe. The gas from the expansion cylinder would not flow until the pressure in it exceeded the pressure in the exhaust pipe.

Ideally, it would be best to let the two expansion cylinders switch to normal operation when extra power or low RPM was needed. That would require some switching of valve timing and gas flow into and out of the cylinders.

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