Cooled EGR

[vtec-e]

I suppose we (general public, not ecomodders!!) couldn't be relied upon to keep a water tank topped up for no apparent gain.

[gone-ot]

Originally Posted by vtec-e

I suppose we (general public, not ecomodders!!) couldn't be relied upon to keep a water tank topped up for no apparent gain.

...interesting, that's exactly the problem that Oldsmobile experienced with their original "Turbo-Rocket Fluid" for the 'Turbo Jetfire' engine back in the 1960's:

"Turbo Jetfire -- In 1962 and 1963 Oldsmobile built a turbocharged version of the 215. The small-diameter Garrett T5 turbocharger was manufactured by Garrett AiResearch and produced a maximum of 5 psi (34 kPa) boost at 2200 rpm. The engine had 10.25:1 compression and a single-barrel carburetor. It was rated at 215 hp (160 kW) @ 4600 rpm and 300 lb·ft (410 N·m) @ 3200 rpm. The high compression ratio created a serious problem with spark knock on hard throttle applications, which led Olds to use a novel water-injection system that sprayed small amounts of distilled water and methyl alcohol (dubbed "Turbo-Rocket Fluid") into the combustion chambers to cool the intake charge. If the fluid reservoir was empty, a complex double-float and valve assembly in the Turbo-Rocket Fluid path would set a second butterfly (positioned between the throttle butterfly and the turbocharger) into the closed position, limiting the amount of boost pressure. Unfortunately, many customers did not keep the reservoir filled, or had mechanical problems with the turbocharger plumbing.
The turbocharger was offered only in a special Jetfire model, which was the first turbocharged passenger car offered for public sale. Only 9,607 were sold in two model years, and many were converted by dealers to conventional four-barrel carbureted form."[Wiki]

[stovie]

i was thinking someone needs to see what happens when you put a jar of water inline of the egr supply line cause the water evaporates at 212 degrees and that should also act as a soot and particulate filter by putting the gritty stuff in the water and heating the water into evaporate so it's also like a water injection(by putting the jar of water right after the exhaust manifold it should almost eliminate the need to clean you egr valve and other parts!!!) also if you have to much gas bubbling through the water in the jar you could get to much water in the engine so get a tube thats the same diameter as the egr supply line and rap it in a spiral at the bottom of the jar and put like 1/8 inch holes every 1/2 inch around the spiral so that you will have the proper amount of eg through the jar without over bubbling and the smaller bubbles also allow more cleaning of the gases.

[ShadeTreeMech]

with a deep enough reservoir of water, that could work to clean out the grit. I'd been contemplating increasing the egr amount to save fuel, but didn't want to dirty up the engine. Bubbling the exhaust through water ought to do it!

[UFO]

That sounds like a good idea! Let the car breathe through a water pipe.

[COcyclist]

Air can be compressed, fluids cannot. I do not want to be the first to experiment with hydro-locking up my diesel engine. Proceed with caution. The EGR pipes on my car are 1" or 25mm. That could suck up a lot of water.

[ConnClark]

Originally Posted by stovie

i was thinking someone needs to see what happens when you put a jar of water inline of the egr supply line cause the water evaporates at 212 degrees and that should also act as a soot and particulate filter by putting the gritty stuff in the water and heating the water into evaporate so it's also like a water injection(by putting the jar of water right after the exhaust manifold it should almost eliminate the need to clean you egr valve and other parts!!!) also if you have to much gas bubbling through the water in the jar you could get to much water in the engine so get a tube thats the same diameter as the egr supply line and rap it in a spiral at the bottom of the jar and put like 1/8 inch holes every 1/2 inch around the spiral so that you will have the proper amount of eg through the jar without over bubbling and the smaller bubbles also allow more cleaning of the gases.

The problem with this approach is you would cool the water vapor in the exhaust gases below boiling point and condense it. This means you have to expend energy to over come the energy of enthalpy again to convert it back to steam during combustion.

[stovie]

connclark - the main reason for the water is to filter the crap out of the exhaust gases in my opinion the bonus is added water vapor in the combustion to hopefully lower combustion temps for lower nox and the exhaust gases that are going into the jar are usually about 300 degrees so that should actually get the water itself to within range of it's boiling point so it reduces that

COcyclist - there's really not that much risk of sucking up water into your engine if you set the jar up properly you have it about 3/4 of the way full with a spiral that only lets little bubbles through so it doesn't bubble to your supply line thats only in the jar about 1/2 an inch i have this set up on my jeep but instead of water i have fuel in the jar but no exhaust gas flowing through just air

[Phantom]

Also something like stainless steal wool will help spread the heat in the water and if the SS sits higher than the water it will reduce the splash of the bubbles. A plate could be placed in the jar with a hole on the opposite side from the outlet. So top right exit, then a plate below with a hole on the left side for gas to flow below that is an air gap then the water with the EGR pipe running in to it.

[stovie]

i put a jar of water on my jeep and ran the exhaust gases through it, so far it's quited the exhaust(that i cut off 3 feet from the exhaust manifold so it was pretty loud) to where it sounds like i have a flowmaster on. it smoothed the idle and so far i'v noticed a 4-5 mpg increase, i'll let you now how it does.