Found a 2011 Nissan Leaf for $5,900

[rmay635703]

Originally Posted by Stubby79

Why?

45k doesn't seem like a lot to me. (but I haven't put a lot of research in to it)

The cheapest I've seen here was ~$10k (8k US), notably cheaper than any other...I asked why. It had a lot more miles on it than 45k, and the battery range was at about 75%...that's why it was cheaper. (and it sold within a few days of my discovering it).

Don't they have a big warranty for the battery?

Leaf batteries from 2011 to early 2013 are notoriously terrible

If that car was anywhere but the UP of Michigan it has likely lost at least 3 battery bars , likely more.

Nissan does not warranty capacity out of the box so the 8/100 warranty only covers completely failed batteries.

In other words that battery could only hold half a charge and per Nissan it would be fine.

Now if that car was under $5k with original battery I might consider it since my drive to work is only 5 miles but much further than that a 2011 Leaf might be useless in the winter.

That said if the battery was replaced it’s worth the price.

A leaf is definitely not bulletproof like a volt

[oil pan 4]

My wife's drive to work is like 4 miles and mine is maybe 12.
I would like to use it to go to the next nearest town which is 50 miles round trip.
It appears to be short between 1 and 1.5 battery bars, and is getting 3.3 miles per KWH. It may not be from around these parts.
Winters are short here, but can be briefly burtal.
I do have a garage that will be partially heated by my coal furnace.

[Daox]

You've probably read it, but this is super helpful for seeing what Nissan changed over the years:

https://insideevs.com/used-nissan-leaf-buying-guide/

[JSH]

Originally Posted by oil pan 4

My wife's drive to work is like 4 miles and mine is maybe 12.
I would like to use it to go to the next nearest town which is 50 miles round trip.
It appears to be short between 1 and 1.5 battery bars, and is getting 3.3 miles per KWH. It may not be from around these parts.
Winters are short here, but can be briefly burtal.
I do have a garage that will be partially heated by my coal furnace.

You won't get 50 miles round trip in a 2011 Leaf with the original battery.

My commute to work is 50 miles round trip. Starting with a full battery and preheated cabin my Spark EV uses about 30% of the battery capacity to run the heater on low to keep the windows from fogging. (Temp set to 72F, fan speed to 1 of 5, outside temp about 40 to 45F) That is why you don't want a Leaf with the electric resistance heater.

Just for reference: My Spark is basically new. It is rated at 82 miles range. I get 90 miles in the summer even running the A/C but only 60 in the winter running minimal heat in mild Portland winters. (EDIT: For reference the 2011 LEAF was only rated at 72 miles when new)

I know you want to pay cash, I do the same. However I would wait and save until I could afford a later model LEAF as it is a much better car. The early LEAFs will drop in value even more when the batteries are out of warranty. A replacement costs $5500 though it is the later battery that is better.

The LEAF is also the only 1st gen EV I would personally buy. Nissan designed a car to be sold the the masses and has sold about 300K. The other OEMs converted a current car into a EV to sell the 2K per year required for CARB's EV mandate. I have zero confidence I would be able to get parts for my Spark out of warranty and there is no aftermarket support. That is why I leased my Spark even though I could have purchased it for only $11K.

[MetroMPG]

Originally Posted by oil pan 4

The car is 100 miles away but I'm not worried about getting it home, I already have the EV accessories every electric car owner will wish that they had some point, a diesel truck, car trailer and portable gen sets.

Thanks for the chuckle!

FYI, potentially useful: http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthrea...eaf-33877.html

At this point, I've owned most of the eco cars I've wanted to try. I'd love an EV (mostly for the novelty of the driving experience), but practically speaking, it wouldn't suit my driving patterns. (I tend to drive mostly highway excursions, and bike most of my local trips.)

Unfortunately, like you, I'm disinclined to piss away money just for the heck of it. The only way I'd be getting an EV is if I found a deal I was confident I could re-sell later and at least break even.

Good luck on your hunt!

[JSH]

Originally Posted by MetroMPG

...Unfortunately, like you, I'm disinclined to piss away money just for the heck of it. The only way I'd be getting an EV is if I found a deal I was confident I could re-sell later and at least break even.

As a counterpoint - I love vehicles with high depreciation. I generally buy 2-4 year old car in good shape that is coming off lease and keep it for 10 years. Residual value is meaningless if you don't expect to sell a car shortly after you purchase it.

I leased the Spark EV because:

1. The $100 a month $0 down lease rate was too good to pass up.
2. Much better EVs were just around the corner
3. I don't trust GM to support the Spark long term because it is a compliance car

The lease was a really cheap way to try out an EV.

What I have found is that the 60 mile winter range is OK for my use (commuting 50 miles a day) but about a 100 mile range would make the car much more useful. I personally don't need or want to pay for 200+ miles of range in an EV.

[roosterk0031]

I missed everything after gun show, I'm liking a AR in 450 bushmaster so I can use it deer hunting during shotgun season here.

[oil pan 4]

Obviously I would not pay anywhere near 6,000 for it. Because I don't have that much and I don't think it's worth it.

[redpoint5]

I basically wouldn't buy earlier than '13 unless the battery was replaced, or the car was being sold extremely cheap. It seems many people have experienced capacity loss near to what is warrantied by Nissan, but not quite enough to get a replacement (44% loss before 5 years). The guy below describes a good sense for what to expect capacity wise from a used Leaf.

you can’t set the bars to an arbitrary value (the only choice is current or max, you can’t set it from 9 to 10). But you can reset them back to full 12. Every time you drive the car the system evaluates and updates the bar status. This will in time return to the true value if it was set to 12 for any reason. Unfortunately under normal use this will take months.

So to recap
1 car starts at 12 bars at factory
2 car degrades to less than 12 bars in use
3 car can be reset to 12 bars temporarily
4 car will always return to correct value eventually

the key is not to buy the car between #3 and #4 unless you are getting it for the same price you would get one of a known lower bar status.

Target used options are modified if the car is near or above the 60,000 mile mark or the 5 year mark.

12 bars (never trust, even if not reset it should be treated as 11 bars, but might be lower)
11 bars (treat as 11 or 10 but know it might be as low as 8, treat it as 8 if the miles are over 60,000 and you haven’t done a range test or used a obdii reader)
10 bars (treat as 10 or 9 but know it might be as low as 8, treat it as 8 if the miles are over 60,000 and you haven’t done a range test or used a obdii reader)
9 bars (treat as 9 but know it might be as low as 8, treat it as 8 if the miles are over 60,000 and you haven’t done a range test or used a obdii reader)
8 bars treat at face value if above 60,000 miles, jump for joy if below 60,000 miles and treat it carefully knowing you’ll be able to get a free battery but only if you do it before rolling the odometer too far or waiting too long.
7 bars or less and more than 60,000 miles take at face value.

So how much is a bar worth? Well if a battery is replaced at 8 bars to take it back to 12 and it cost $4,000 then a bar is worth $1000.

Compare your two or three used leafs carefully and get the best deal you can knowing it will take work to verify battery capacity. You can’t just sit in the car and trust the dash.

bar loss capacity
1 85.00%
2 78.75%
3 72.50%
4 66.25%

[oil pan 4]

I'm thinking the current market value for one is close to around $5,000. So what I'm willing to pay and market value are not that far off from each other.

Then there is dreaded battery replacement.
But it looks like old leaf battery modules are pretty valuable. There are 48 of them in the car and it would appear they could be broken down and sold for at least $40 each.