Honda Insight w/Acura TSX engine - Ecomodding

[Ecky]

Originally Posted by ME_Andy

Holy crap that's fast. What is that, like 3s to 60?

Probably closer to 5 with winter tires, from a dead stop, just because I can't get traction. I think with the right rubber and good weather it's likely around 4 seconds if I'm not already rolling.

[M_a_t_t]

Dang. Now I want to abandon what I'm currently doing and work on my Nissan.

[Ecky]

When I woke this morning, the outside temperature was 7F. I believe it was around 0F overnight. I averaged 46.5mpg on my 13 mile commute to work, and 45.5mpg on my way home, both cold starts.

On the way in, I held off running the heater until the coolant temperature hit 155F. It didn't reach 160F before I arrived. The grille is 100% blocked.

[serialk11r]

It's kind of funny, when you have an inefficient big V6 like my Infiniti, the temperature gauge moves up kind of unbelievably fast (reaches the middle in around 2 miles of driving) compared to when I had my 1.8L Toyota MR2 Spyder which wouldn't hit 160F for many many miles.

I'm kind of surprised your engine is warming up that slowly with the grill fully blocked.

[Ecky]

Originally Posted by serialk11r

It's kind of funny, when you have an inefficient big V6 like my Infiniti, the temperature gauge moves up kind of unbelievably fast (reaches the middle in around 2 miles of driving) compared to when I had my 1.8L Toyota MR2 Spyder which wouldn't hit 160F for many many miles.

I'm kind of surprised your engine is warming up that slowly with the grill fully blocked.

I've found it rises quickly when I let it idle - as in, fully warm in ~10 minutes. I can only see this being for two reasons:

1) When idling, there's no air moving over the engine, and
2) Ignition timing is very retarded, meaning a lot of energy is being lost out of the exhaust, not doing any useful work.

I would have thought very retarded ignition timing would cause it to warm up more slowly, rather than faster. Over-advance and you have the heated charge sitting in the cylinder longer. Over-retard, and most of it goes out the exhaust.

I figure at least part of it is that, since it's running at basically 1% load to move the car down the road (I literally see throttle positions of 1-3% under many driving conditions), the air blowing over the block, or even just the oil pan, is enough to keep a relatively efficient engine cool. K series may not be 41-44% thermally efficient like the stock engine, but they're still pretty darn efficient for what they are.

[hayden55]

Originally Posted by Ecky

When I woke this morning, the outside temperature was 7F. I believe it was around 0F overnight. I averaged 46.5mpg on my 13 mile commute to work, and 45.5mpg on my way home, both cold starts.

On the way in, I held off running the heater until the coolant temperature hit 155F. It didn't reach 160F before I arrived. The grille is 100% blocked.

True that. It was -20 here yesterday. It didn't even get warm on the inside of the cabin the whole 20 miles to work. That was max heat the entire time lol. I think Fwt was maybe 140 max at the end. Today I didn't take any chances. I packed snow into every grill opening. hahaha
Got to 188 max within 6 blocks! (not negatives today )

https://www.5newsonline.com/article/...0-fb2cb4c0c7a6

[some_other_dave]

Originally Posted by serialk11r

It's kind of funny, when you have an inefficient big V6 like my Infiniti, the temperature gauge moves up kind of unbelievably fast (reaches the middle in around 2 miles of driving)...

Keep in mind that many automotive temperature gauges are absurdly non-linear. Some of them read in the middle of the range from something like 100F to 230F. Others are linear and sensible.

... Hmmm, come to think of it, that is based on older cars. It is possible that things are better on more recent cars, especially since modern EFI uses coolant temp as a fairly important input to the engine management. Hmm....

-soD

[Ecky]

Originally Posted by some_other_dave

Keep in mind that many automotive temperature gauges are absurdly non-linear. Some of them read in the middle of the range from something like 100F to 230F. Others are linear and sensible.

... Hmmm, come to think of it, that is based on older cars. It is possible that things are better on more recent cars, especially since modern EFI uses coolant temp as a fairly important input to the engine management. Hmm....

-soD

My work van's gauge moves to the middle within around 30 seconds of startup, when turning on the heater still blows ice cold air. It's definitely a dummy gauge.

I've programmed my Insight gauge to move from "cold" 2 bars to 4 bars at ~150F, next increment at ~180F, then another at 220F.

[Piotrsko]

From my work at the rocket site: thermocouples are extremely linear (at least the JK ones we used) so manufacturers have resorted to some sort of gauge tampering for whatever effect they desire. The advantage of computer control is that mostly you have access to that data being read, realtime.

My F250 with it's 8 gallons of diesel heated coolant takes 5 miles of loaded travel to have effective defrost, 10 miles to have a warm cab in 30 degree weather. At idle it looses as much heat as it produces.

[Ecky]

Got my new pulley installed. I needed a new belt as well, and decided to go with one that had one fewer rib (6 vs 7) while I was at it. The belt's effective length was 66 inches, but I would probably have picked out one @ 66.25" if it were available.

Preliminary results:

Earlier this week I had a commute where the outside temperature was nearly 40F. The roads were damp, but clear. Nobody was on the road, and I was able to maximize EOC I arrived at work with 53mpg on the gauge.

This morning it was 26F. The roads were a bit slushy. There was some traffic, and I wasn't able to EOC nearly as much. I arrived at work with... 53mpg on the gauge.

Yesterday after swapping out the pulley, I made a trip to and from my local auto parts store, to return a belt I didn't need. I averaged 55mpg on the way there, and 56mpg on the way back. I don't think I've beat those numbers on that trip, even in the height of summer.

It's tough to draw any conclusions based on such limited data, but I know for certain that my biggest single waster of fuel is the "minimum load" or parasitic drag from the engine - it's relatively thirsty even when idle, and that caps my maximum achievable fuel economy without heavy EOC at around 65mpg. This is the sort of mod that helps with that.