I give up.

[Joenavy85]

yes, you can flush the entire system, clear all the lube out and "start from scratch", but it is a painstaking process, clearing out the compressor is relatively easy, but when it comes to the condenser it's another story, it's one thing when it's on a 400 Ton Reefer Unit like what i work on, but completely different on something that fits in your engine compartment.when you have to replace 2 or 3 of the 4 "biggest" sections of the system it's better in the long run to replace the entire system. everytime you change out a major part on a system you risk having that part die the same way the previous one did, even when you've taken the measures to prevent it. but i don't understand how the electric motor lubricant could get into the system, though if it did i can safely say that it would destroy the system. the wrong SYSTEM lube, yes, the wrong MOTOR lube, i doubt it

[Joenavy85]

Originally Posted by Frank Lee

NO! If you really want to find out what service and replacement parts rape feels like, get a Honda motorcycle.

my ex's dad had one from the mid 90's (couldn't tell you the model) and all he did was complain about the cost of fixing it when it broke, and yet he refused to get rid of it

[Joenavy85]

also take into account that the incorrect system lubricant can cause corrosion to the inside of the system, some metals don't like some lubricants, at which point some AC techs will start to laugh at you for thinking you can just flush it and be good to go.

[roflwaffle]

Originally Posted by cfg83

rmay635703 -I like to "claim" that there is a sweet spot when OBD-II came along from 1996 to maybe the early 2000s. Before that, scangauges don't work. After that the smarty-pants computers start fighting with you if they don't like your drivetrain mods.

Depending on the vehicle I really like OBDI. I've passed multiple smog checks w/ non-functional hardware (EGR/2 stuff) because the remaining inputs are more than enough to pass the sniffer and it won't throw a trouble code for ~50-100 miles after I reset the ECU.

[Thymeclock]

Originally Posted by Frank Lee

NO! If you really want to find out what service and replacement parts rape feels like, get a Honda motorcycle.

Well at least they aren't building their bikes with air conditioners... yet.

[UFO]

Originally Posted by Ryland

If you end up getting a VW I think you are going to find the same thing as you found with your hybrid, mechanics who don't want to work on it or who do then screw things up, at least judging from the VW's I have owned and worked on and the friends who have VW's who have to call around to all the shops to find someone who is willing to buy the special tools that only VW uses.

This is absolutely correct. VW TDIs are excellent cars, but the problem with these is you CANNOT use the dealer for service. VW dealers are notorious for over-filling and using the wrong oil, for not using the proper tools or parts to replace timing belts, for causing more damage and covering it up. The new CR TDIs have $4000-$10,000 bills if the dealer or factory determines you used bad fuel, and I suspect they are covering up for a poorly manufactured or designed fuel system.

Eyes open.

[payne171]

And yet, how many TDi's are on the road still with 300,000+ miles? How many hybrids? We have owned our Saturn for 9+ years and 162,000 miles. How long can we make the VW last? If I remember right, there is a shop down by Ohio State U (O-H!) that specializes in VW/Mercedes repair and maintenance. I'm not saying hybrids are bad, m'kay? The whole event has caused me to rethink being on the leading edge of technology. With the VW, the only part of the car that is cutting edge is the fuel injection system, yet it can get what I want from our next car- a comfortable ride, a nice interior, and savings on fuel in excess of $100 per month versus our previous car, a Jeep Wrangler Unlimited. That requires about 30 mpg on gasoline or 33 on diesel.

[NachtRitter]

Yep, I also agree / support the TDI approach for fuel efficiency... a lot of benefits. But definitely agree with UFO as well... There are many niggling issues and some catastrophic issues that you really need to watch out for on the TDI... Fred's TDI club forum is an excellent resource!

[wdb]

Originally Posted by Thymeclock

It sounds like they built the entire car around the AC system. How brilliant.

That's one way of looking at it I guess. The other way of looking at it is, they found a way to keep A/C running on a hybrid even with the engine shut down. A nice little plus for folks in the Arizona desert, or Houston TX, or any of a bazillion other places that are extraordinarily hot&humid and have people living in them who drive cars.

If you ever buy another Honda, make it a two-wheeled version, not four.

I'm sorry but I don't get the connection. I have a Honda and it is so dead simple to fix that I do it myself. The fact that the Honda hybrid is complex is not evidence that all Hondas are junk. And frankly I'm more than a bit perturbed by the general impression around here that hybrids are somehow supposed to everything they do AND be simple to fix. The world doesn't work that way.

All that having been said: I personally feel a wee bit vindicated by this tale of woe. I've been avoiding hybrids because I think their added complexity can only mean added maintenance headaches, sooner or later. And since I keep my cars until they rot out from under me, that matters a lot. I think I'll stick with my decision for now. Maybe someday hybrid systems will be standardized sufficiently, and techs trained enough, to make owning one for longer than a lease term a practical idea. But it sounds to me like that time has not yet arrived.

[cfg83]

wdb -

Originally Posted by wdb

That's one way of looking at it I guess. The other way of looking at it is, they found a way to keep A/C running on a hybrid even with the engine shut down. A nice little plus for folks in the Arizona desert, or Houston TX, or any of a bazillion other places that are extraordinarily hot&humid and have people living in them who drive cars.

Isn't this the direction A/Cs are going anyway? In the old daze A/C compressors were either on or off. I thought that new A/C compressors vary their output based on cooling needs.

CarloSW2