Petrol vs Diesel

[Odin]

Originally Posted by fidalgoman

I as well prefer the diesel. One major issue is local availability. It is true that diesel trucks will be running even if the cars don't should there be a shortage of fuel, but that doesn't mean you'll be able to buy any. Considering the small MPG difference I'd buy whatever is more common (if it's a huge availability difference).

Europe doesn't have the state side issue of every station not having diesel since i believe majority of the cars there are diesel

[piers.singer]

I've been considering a small diesel as well - the Renault Clio 1.5 dci 65 seems quite attractive as it's posted at 65mpg and can be had used for not a lot of money at all. In its case, http://www.spritmonitor.de lists anything from 43mpg to 75, with an average of 58mpg, so I think that 60mpg would be a reasonable achievement in the real world without hypermiling or modifications.

I've only ever driven petrols up until now and so I have no idea if the extra mpg will be worth suffering the foibles of diesel engines. The 1.2 petrol (closest power output) is posted at 48mpg, making the diesel 35% more economical.

[Arragonis]

Originally Posted by 320touring

£800 got a W plate Lupo 1.0 MPI petrol from the auctions I was at today..

Thats gotta be a WIN above any PSA rubbish? or they did a 1.4 diesel..

Have you driven a Lupo 1.0 ? Thats rubbish, right there...

There is a C1 Diesel 1.4 but its a non-intercoolled low pressure thing - 54 bhp. Thats about the same as a Citroen Ax NA 1.4 Rotary pump Diesel. But it has an ECU which is a wick and a wick can be turned up.

Originally Posted by piers.singer

I've been considering a small diesel as well - the Renault Clio 1.5 dci 65 seems quite attractive as it's posted at 65mpg and can be had used for not a lot of money at all....

A Mk3 (facelifted Mk2) is OK as long as you check the bonnet lock thing. The later one (aka the Diesel Nissan Leaf ) is very very very very heavy. And ugly.

[TheEnemy]

None of them have great long-term, high-mileage longevity but my mileage is low and I have minor spannering abilities. The great thing about looking at a used one is that the lose value very quickly

Thats one of my flags to warn me against buying a specific car for a long term investment. What you save up front is usually more than made up for by what you spend keeping it running. Not to mention the hassle of having to fix it, sometimes at inconvienient times.

Unless of course your plan is to buy it, drive it into the ground and scrap it.

[Arragonis]

The known problems are :

Early clutch failed quickly - replaced by a larger one, all done under warranty by now.
Rear exhaust cylinder rots very quickly - stainless replacement
Gear change joint thingy wears - better replacement available

Nothing major mechanically and none of them rusting as yet. They are one of the most highly depreciating cars available though so whilst I wait they get cheaper. I don't change for a long time so I'm not too concerned about resale value for me.

[320touring]

The C1 is not a patch on a Lupo! My parents had a 1.0 mpi arosa (we called it the arouser..) took everything thrown at it, and was fun.

If you're looking for a "minimalist" motor thats reliable, cheap to run and big enough for occasional "Family forrays" then its got to be a KA..

[ShadeTreeMech]

In the small car category, a petrol and diesel sound to be about even. I would do a cost comparison of cost per mile which would take into account the difference in fuel costs.

FWIW, a "peppy" engine encourages a bit more aggressive driving. Assuming you can resist the urge to rev the bolts off of it, you'd likely get better than average economy quite easily.

But with the diesel you can make use of the used chip fat and motor oil by dumping it into the fuel tank after a bit of filtering. Of course, with a mainly full tank I do that with a petrol powered vehicle with no issues.

[Arragonis]

Originally Posted by 320touring

The C1 is not a patch on a Lupo! My parents had a 1.0 mpi arosa (we called it the arouser..) took everything thrown at it, and was fun.

Horses for courses I suppose. Its not on my list. A TDi maybe.

Originally Posted by 320touring

If you're looking for a "minimalist" motor thats reliable, cheap to run and big enough for occasional "Family forrays" then its got to be a KA..

The later ones (the Fiat 500 based ones) are not impressive in Petrol form. The TDCi is expensive but there are a few about.

Just spotted a cheap-ish Mini One D...

[Odin]

Originally Posted by ShadeTreeMech

But with the diesel you can make use of the used chip fat and motor oil by dumping it into the fuel tank after a bit of filtering. Of course, with a mainly full tank I do that with a petrol powered vehicle with no issues.

veggie oil in a petrol engine? this is a first, how well does it do?

[Arragonis]

Originally Posted by ShadeTreeMech

In the small car category, a petrol and diesel sound to be about even. I would do a cost comparison of cost per mile which would take into account the difference in fuel costs.

Tricky because of servicing. I may start to do minor ones myself again and leave the bigger stuff (timing belts) to the professionals. Some come with deals that include the servicing but you know its going to be the bare basic servicing, cheap materials etc.

Originally Posted by ShadeTreeMech

FWIW, a "peppy" engine encourages a bit more aggressive driving. Assuming you can resist the urge to rev the bolts off of it, you'd likely get better than average economy quite easily.

I had a Matiz which has a revvy 3 cyl 800cc when I moved to Edinburgh. The engine was OK for no power (55 hp) and I never went over 40. What killed it for me was the awful ride (very narrow so it swayed a lot) and the awful gearchange. One technique to keep up momentum was to arrive at a roundabout in the right gear and speed so you could feed into the flow, but I could never get 2nd gear from 3rd, only from 1st.

The absolute final straw was when the dent repair guy fixed a massive ding in the bonnet just using his fingers.