Range-related BEV aero thought experiment

[freebeard]

"a normal size car..." you say?

2024 Chevy Goliath - AI TV ad

[Piotrsko]

Chevrolet been doing that for the last 50.yearz. i drove a heavy haul towtruck with a pickup cab on it back when you were working

[redpoint5]

Originally Posted by Isaac Zachary

It seems that the majority of people have this concept that they need a tall, boxy SUV (or crossover, but everyone calls them all SUV's) or a pickup that guzzles lots of gas in order to fit into society.

I prefer putting kids into a taller vehicle than a shorter one. I prefer putting any object(s) into taller vehicles. They are easier to get into and out of. That said, I am perfectly willing to put in more effort to do those things in a lower vehicle, but most people aren't.

I'm not willing to have a trunk anymore. A hatch is so much more useful that aero penalties are worth it.

What gets me is how many vehicles are very large, but still can't fit 3 car seats in the back.

Shopping 3-row EVs, the only options were Model Y, Model X, and recently the EV9, oh, and the Rivian... all are super expensive, so I got the least costly among them, and Tesla apparently has stopped making the Y with the 3rd row.

Originally Posted by aerohead

During our black-ice events, about all you see, upside-down in the bar ditches besides the road, are the CUVs, SUVs. and 'off-road' pickups the television ads purport to be unconquerable in foul weather.

I'll reiterate your point by mentioning that when it snows 1" here, everyone drives their RWD pickup truck with mud tires instead of their FWD CUV, which at least has all season tires and more even weight distribution.

[freebeard]

i drove a heavy haul towtruck with a pickup cab on it back when you were working

That recently?

Until two years ago I knew of a 1958 GMC COE sitting amongst a hedgerow of rusty trucks. I met the guy last weekend who owned it, he said they drove it out of there.

I wanted to get it just to put a 1958 Cadillac bumper on it. The closest DDG shows is this '56 Chevy with '57 bumper:


https://i1.wp.com/atxcarpics.com/wp-...4/04/1956-.jpg

[Isaac Zachary]

Originally Posted by redpoint5

I prefer putting kids into a taller vehicle than a shorter one. I prefer putting any object(s) into taller vehicles. They are easier to get into and out of. That said, I am perfectly willing to put in more effort to do those things in a lower vehicle, but most people aren't.

I'm not willing to have a trunk anymore. A hatch is so much more useful that aero penalties are worth it.

Everyone has their own opinion, and I respect that, even if I disagree. It's just that we are in a democracy and an economy that favors popularity. So it's not freedom of choice, rather abiding by what the majority wants. Still, having an ugly hatchback that I don't like and that I'll never use is better than nothing I guess.

I wonder why we can't just put the hatch in the front and seat everyone backwards with cameras and big screens to see where we're going. You might be able to actually see more than with the current obese A-pillar design, while making the vehicle more aerodynamic and still having a big hatch.

[freebeard]

So it's not freedom of choice, rather abiding by what the majority wants.

Wrong. You can drive whatever you want.

Hoopie -- Talking 1946 Chevy Prius Truck

[Isaac Zachary]

Originally Posted by freebeard

Wrong. You can drive whatever you want.

Hoopie -- Talking 1946 Chevy Prius Truck

With enough money, (most) anything is possible.

But ecomodding is partially about saving money (eco, as in "economic").

[Phase]

Originally Posted by redpoint5

I prefer putting kids into a taller vehicle than a shorter one. I prefer putting any object(s) into taller vehicles. They are easier to get into and out of. That said, I am perfectly willing to put in more effort to do those things in a lower vehicle, but most people aren't.

I'm not willing to have a trunk anymore. A hatch is so much more useful that aero penalties are worth it.

What gets me is how many vehicles are very large, but still can't fit 3 car seats in the back.

Shopping 3-row EVs, the only options were Model Y, Model X, and recently the EV9, oh, and the Rivian... all are super expensive, so I got the least costly among them, and Tesla apparently has stopped making the Y with the 3rd row.



I'll reiterate your point by mentioning that when it snows 1" here, everyone drives their RWD pickup truck with mud tires instead of their FWD CUV, which at least has all season tires and more even weight distribution.

nah, they whip out the subarus with the bald summer racing tires cuz its awd

[redpoint5]

Originally Posted by Isaac Zachary

It's just that we are in a democracy and an economy that favors popularity....

I wonder why we can't just put the hatch in the front and seat everyone backwards with cameras and big screens to see where we're going. You might be able to actually see more than with the current obese A-pillar design, while making the vehicle more aerodynamic and still having a big hatch.

You're not pro-popular vote, are you? :P

I prefer the aesthetics of a sedan, but utility is king, because utilization is more important than vanity.

A-pillars are the worst, and the reason why I move my head about the cabin like a monkey at every 4 way stop; looking for the spontaneously appearing pedestrian. This is the very reason why autonomous driving will be better than us within a decade.

Originally Posted by Phase

nah, they whip out the subarus with the bald summer racing tires cuz its awd

Still better than the stupid RWD trucks with mud tires.

[Isaac Zachary]

Originally Posted by redpoint5

You're not pro-popular vote, are you? :P

I can't say. It would seem to me that just because something is popular doesn't make it right or fair.

Originally Posted by redpoint5

I prefer the aesthetics of a sedan, but utility is king, because utilization is more important than vanity.

For me a trunk lid has more utility. It gets me slightly better fuel mileage and gives me a place to put a second amateur radio antenna. I guess I could use the middle of the hood, but that would look kind of silly. Right now I'm set up to send and receive emergency messages from the islands and countries where Huricane Baryl has barreled through. Having a hatch and missing out on that kind of action isn't worth it to me.

And as I've said before, I did know a lady that got killed in a hatchback from stuff coming up out of the cargo area and hitting her in the head. Plus the trunk of the Avalon, which is a sedan, holds a lot of stuff without being a hatch. The hatchbacks I've driven have had covers that make the hatch area small or smaller than a sedan trunk, which I hope will help keep things from coming up out of there into the cabin area.

I can't remember any time with the Golf or with the Leaf that I folded down the seats and took out the cargo cover. So what's the point in having a hatch? I don't see how putting large objects up into a hatchback or a pickup is easier. My trailer is very low, and when I have help loading or unloading it people tell me all the time how much they like my trailer and ask where they can get theirs. I've worked too many years in construction loading and unloading blasted, akward, back-breaking pickup trucks to want to be raising and lowering large heavy objects that high ever again.

I'm not saying I wouldn't have a hatch. I've now ended up with 4 cars, two recently given to me, and three out of the four are hatchbacks. Of all of those I prefer the Gen 2 Prius style hatch. It's a hatch, and works quite like a typical hatch with only a little less room, but is also quite aerodynamic for a hatch. But I'd wager a bet that I'll never actually put something in any of them that needed to be put in a hatch.