Return of the Stripper

[jamesqf]

Originally Posted by tasdrouille

There is something wrong if people worry how they're gonna make their monthly payment.

Ah, someone who enjoys job security - or the illusion thereof :-)

Not everyone has that, you know. Even in the days when I was working for salary, I more than once had the experience of coming in to work at the latest startup, only to see a bunch of strange faces, and hear the joyful message "Hi, we're from the venture capitalists, and we're here to restructure/shut down. Here's your two weeks severance - clean out your desks, and be gone by 5." In such a case, it's nice to not have a lot of payments to make next month.

[dichotomous]

Originally Posted by jamesqf

No, no, no! Magnetism doesn't work that way. It's a conservative force, like gravity. You can get power by letting something fall downhil, but you have to put in the energy first to get it up the hill. Same with a magnet. You can get energy by letting the magnet pull something towards it, but you have to put in the same amount of energy to pull it away. No free lunch, IOW :-)

I'd imagine creating a rotor/strator setup with no balance point within the fields could fix that. again, see howard johnsons model and the perendev model, both do this effectively.

[trebuchet03]

Originally Posted by dichotomous

as far permanent/rare earth magnets, any magnet that does NOT derive its magnetic field from an electrical current is permanent,

Fixed that for ya

youtube up parendev motor or howard johnson magnet motor and you can see some that appear to work well, the hojo model even running an alternator at pretty high speed.

I see things spinning - and no reason to believe without external inputs.

As James's said - magnetism is conservative... A sum zero force. Mind you, that's not sum zero power - there's no "conservation of power" - you'll always get less than what you put in.

Thermo Laws
1. You can only change the form of energy
2. Losses of an isolated system increase over time
3. As you approach absolute zero, entropy approaches a constant minimum

Translated
1. You can't "make" energy"
2. You Can't Win
3. Entropy is temperature related... And you can't win.

[dichotomous]

Originally Posted by trebuchet03

Fixed that for ya





I see things spinning - and no reason to believe without external inputs.

As James's said - magnetism is conservative... A sum zero force. Mind you, that's not sum zero power - there's no "conservation of power" - you'll always get less than what you put in.

Thermo Laws
1. You can only change the form of energy
2. Losses of an isolated system increase over time
3. As you approach absolute zero, entropy approaches a constant minimum

Translated
1. You can't "make" energy"
2. You Can't Win
3. Entropy is temperature related... And you can't win.

I belive magnetic field's and permanent magnets will be rewriting the "laws" of physics, remember once that the rock solid laws of physics stated that the sun revolved around the earth, they are only our best understanding and most commonly understood and accepted theories.

not that I have figured this all out, but I'm sure someone who understands or has enough money to play with models and stuff could, if I had figured it out I wouldnt be posting under a real account with a real email, the same people who sell energy wont want us figuring out how to produce it ourselves, they'd loose theoretical money.

[tasdrouille]

Originally Posted by dichotomous

I belive magnetic field's and permanent magnets will be rewriting the "laws" of physics.

Until that happens maybe we could stick with factual science.

So...we were talking about stripped down cars....

[trebuchet03]

Originally Posted by dichotomous

I belive magnetic field's and permanent magnets will be rewriting the "laws" of physics

Sun revolving around earth was not a law And these aren't physics laws

You can believe what you want, I can't stop you... I will counter, however, with well documented thermodynamics

[Christ]

QUICK addition to the magnet discovery field... Permanent magnets can lose their force through many many things... Rare Earth Magnets on the other hand create their own Magnetic force, and dont need to be charged.

You throw a PM at the wall, it could very well lose it's magnetic force.

You throw a REM at the wall, it could break in half, you'd just have two REM's now.

Please don't place physically created things in the same category as geographical anomalies.

[dichotomous]

Originally Posted by Christ

QUICK addition to the magnet discovery field... Permanent magnets can lose their force through many many things... Rare Earth Magnets on the other hand create their own Magnetic force, and dont need to be charged.

You throw a PM at the wall, it could very well lose it's magnetic force.

You throw a REM at the wall, it could break in half, you'd just have two REM's now.

Please don't place physically created things in the same category as geographical anomalies.

thats not true. rare earth magnets are magnets created from rare earth materials. you may be thinking of lodestone or magnetite. both of these, when thrown against a wall, could lose their magnetism just the same as a created magnet. all magnets are created the same, the natural ones were formed from the earths magnetic field, the manmade ones were formed from the magnetic field created around them. its the orientaintion of either the particles or ions or electrons within the material, if they are all nice and aligned, they create a field, if they are not, they dont, sharp impacts can send some out of alignment. continous repulsion can as well, think of a rope for this one, you pull it and its straight, the harder you pull the straighter it gets, you push it and is no longer straight.

again, any natural magnet was magnetised by the same principles that we used to create them in a lab. they can be destroyed the same ways. certain formulations of magnetic material are better at resisting demagnification, by repulsion or impact, but all WILL demagnatize eventually under these conditions. NIB (or neodynamin, or "rare-earth" magnets are ALL artificially created, by alloying iron with boron and neodynamin, then grinding that alloy to a fine powder and sintering it back together, this is a magnet blank, THEN they give it a field by exposing it to a very powerfull field, often once already installed in the product (how else would they get things made if they magnet stuck to everything))

[Christ]

OK,I was just watching this on the history (?) channel earlier last month..

There is a type of naturally occurring magnet that does not discharge its' force when broken violently (thrown against a wall.) I might be mistaken though.

BTW, I've rebuilt computer hard drives... those magnets are a ***** to work around when youre putting the pickup head back in place... better to energize them after construction, I'd say.

[jamesqf]

Originally Posted by dichotomous

I belive magnetic field's and permanent magnets will be rewriting the "laws" of physics...

Maybe this would make more sense if explained in terms of the laws of psychology. In this case, bluntly stated "There's a sucker born every minute, and two to take him." Or "If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is." I'm sure someone is planning to make money out of those "magnet motors" - just like they make money out of HHO kits, penis enlargement devices, Nigerian dictators needing help to move money abroad, and all the other scams that con men have come up with to separate suckers from their money.