Tesla Model Y

[wdb]

What differentiates this thing from the Model X? Is it the (optional - gasp) 3rd row seating? Is Tesla following the market with ever-larger vehicles? I wonder how that sits with econorati.

[redpoint5]

Price, size, and features differentiates it from Model X. Have you seen the Y compared to the 3? It's the same car, but bigger and taller.

Tesla is following consumer demand, which right now is midsize CUVs.

Here's the Model 3 with the Model Y shadow behind it:

[JSH]

Originally Posted by RedDevil

The $40,000 SR RWD does it in 5.9. Not a slouch, try find an ICE SUV of that price that comes near.

The problem with your logic is that the Model Y is not a SUV it is a hatchback.

The Ford Focus RS does 0-60 in 4.5 seconds and costs $41,000
The Ford Focus ST does 0-60 in 5.9 seconds and costs $25,000

[RedDevil]

The problem with your logic is that it is absent. The Focus is a small car!

https://www.automobiledimension.com/...ord/focus-2018

I wonder how you are going to put 7 adults in that.

Unlike its predecessors, the new Focus ST won’t come to the U.S., as Ford decided to stop offering most of its passenger cars in North America.

Seems like you can fit exactly 0 adults.

[redpoint5]

I think the point is made though that EVs are more expensive than their ICE counterparts, even if there is no exact counterpart. $40k buys a heck of a lot of car in the ICE world with no drawbacks should someone want to travel beyond the single "tank" range. They are also extremely reliable these days too. I've had nothing of note to mention maintenance wise from any of my ICE vehicles with exception of the truck and the Jeep I briefly owned (avoid Chrysler brands and you'll be fine).

...and I'll mention Tesla has no intention of selling $40k Model Y's, just as they have fought as hard as possible to not sell $35k Model 3s. Those that purchased 4 weeks ago with a 2-4 week delivery estimate are being told to expect another 4-6 weeks for for delivery. They are also getting called and asked if they want to spend another $2,500 for the + version. Clearly $40k is to get your attention, and not a realistic expectation of what will be available. I have no problem waiting long periods of time for something, but if Tesla called me and asked if I wanted a car sooner for $2,500 more, I'd tell them they have 1 week to deliver the car I have a placed a $2,500 earnest payment for, or they can keep their car and send me the $2,500 back. Slimy as hell.

For the public to widely adopt EVs, they have to either be way, way better in many regards than an ICE to make up for the extra cost and charging hassle, or the cost needs to come way down. Simply going faster isn't enough of a pull for the majority of people. Doesn't matter if it goes 0-60 in 2 seconds if the infrastructure to get you from point A to point B and C aren't there, or it's there, but you'll have to stop for an hour several times along the way.

We're getting a lot closer, and the uptick in EV sales is evidence of this, but we're not there yet.

[JSH]

Originally Posted by RedDevil

The problem with your logic is that it is absent. The Focus is a small car!

https://www.automobiledimension.com/...ord/focus-2018

I wonder how you are going to put 7 adults in that.



Seems like you can fit exactly 0 adults.

Please give some real tangible features that make the Model Y a SUV while the Focus is a car.

The Model Y rear seats are for toddlers.

I can buy a Focus from my Ford dealer today. That isn't the case for the Model Y. Next year I would have to buy a Golf GTI for $28,000

[RedDevil]

Originally Posted by JSH

Please give some real tangible features that make the Model Y a SUV while the Focus is a car.

The Model Y rear seats are for toddlers.

I can buy a Focus from my Ford dealer today. That isn't the case for the Model Y. Next year I would have to buy a Golf GTI for $28,000

The Model Y is not a SUV by the definition, I'll giove you that. But it does have a lot of interior space, more actually than most SUVs do.
As you can see a few posts back the Y is much higher than the 3 while the floor stays at the same level. The positioning of the seats is moved forward substantially. The seats of the 3rd row appear to be relatively deep, so you probably have your knees in the air if you sit there as an adult, but headroom appears OK as the roof is still quite high even there.

The Y looks like an European hatchback, more or less, but it is 10-15% bigger in all directions. And that is what matters.

It is true that EV still comes at a premium in many cases, but that will change. You cannot find a better combination of space, performance and price than the Y will offer - never mind utility, safety, etc.

And yes you cannot buy it yet.
It just got announced, and production will only start next year. Should Tesla not announce cars?
Nothing Tesla does can make you happy it seems, except if they disappeared in a puff of smoke. When, if ever, did you write something plainly positive about Tesla?

[Vman455]

Originally Posted by JSH

Please give some real tangible features that make the Model Y a SUV while the Focus is a car.

That doesn't matter one bit.

First off, the CFR definition of a light truck doesn't even matter for other government arms like the EPA or NHTSA, and the public certainly doesn't care what it says. They each use their own definitions, which is how you get a vehicle like the PT Cruiser classified as a truck by one and a car by the other.

Second, no "definition" matters to car buyers: their only concerns are image and perceived utility, and those are determined by marketing. If a car is styled and marketed as a CUV, it's a CUV. The Hyundai Kona is smaller in every dimension except height than the Focus ST, but the Kona is a crossover and the FoST is not. The Ecosport has less cargo capacity and less headroom than the Focus hatch, but it's a CUV and the Focus is not. The Hyundai Ioniq and Kia Niro are exactly the same vehicle underneath--same platform, same drivetrain, same footprint--yet one is a car and the other is a CUV, because it's entirely about the image. And by that metric, the Model Y is a CUV, not a car. It's been designed this way specifically to differentiate it from the Model 3.

[NeilBlanchard]

Originally Posted by JSH

It should be quick for $52,000. The extra $25,000 you pay for the Model Y buys a LOT of gasoline.

The base price is probably more like $40k.

[redpoint5]

Uh-huh, like the base price of the Model 3 is $35k, and nobody has taken delivery on one of those yet?

I'm sure a few people will finally get the opportunity to buy a $40k Y, but as I've repeated, it will be at least a year after the initial launch. Besides all that, $40k is a heck of a lot of money for a vehicle. I've bought 4-unit property for $62k.

My guess is we are still at least a decade out from EVs being sold in quantities large enough to severely impact ICE sales.