vacuumizing fuel for better economy

[stovie]

yes i ran the same on all runs with cruise. I was also wanting to put a jar of water in the egr line to clean the gunk out of the exhaust gas and to give me kind of a water injection set up, from what i understand the exhaust gas can hit 300 to about 1200 so it could possibly increase water vapor sent into the engine by exhaust temps will also reducing the production of nox i think????

[Joenavy85]

your engine will not run hot enough to ever benefit from water injection, don't waste your time. i agree with previous posts stating that you need to learn how these systems work before you start modifying them. EGR recircs INERT exhaust gases back to the intake, inert exhaust displaces the amount of combustible matter in the cylinder. Water injection was used in WW2 fighter aircraft to prevent premature detonation of the F/A mixture due to high operating temperatures, they still use it modern day on racing aircraft at the Reno air races, those aircraft engines are typically V12 engine with around 1500 cubic inches and around 4000HP with manifold pressures as high as 120 inches (ie, 44 pounds of boost) so unless that is what you are running it will likely do you no good. if it does do anything it will likely cool your intake charge and increase the humidity which will likely cause incomplete combustion, which can result in gas vapor in your exhaust which will slowly destroy your cats which you will then have to replace, negating any money you saved with increased fuel economy that was never really there

[Joenavy85]

look up "Water injection (engines)" on wikipedia

and don't give me that "oh, it's wikipedia so it's not accurate" a friend of mine races his P-51 at Reno and uses this system, i know how it works and what it does, IT WILL NOT HELP YOUR FUEL ECONOMY

[cfguy2000]

Wikipedia got me through college

[stovie]

the reason i was wanting to you the water is to cool the egr gases and eliminate the build up of crap in the egr system

Effects

In a piston engine, the initial injection of water cools the fuel-air mixture significantly, which increases its density and hence the amount of mixture that enters the cylinder. An additional effect comes later during combustion when the water absorbs large amounts of heat as it vaporizes, reducing peak temperature and resultant NOx formation, and reducing the amount of heat energy absorbed into the cylinder walls. This also converts part of combustion energy from the form of heat to the form of pressure. As the water droplets vaporize by absorbing heat, it turns to high pressure steam (water vapor or steam mainly resulted from combustion chemical reaction), that would add engine output. The alcohol in the mixture burns, but is also much more resistant to detonation than gasoline. The net result is a higher octane charge that will support very high compression ratios or significant forced induction pressures before onset of detonation.
Fuel economy can be improved with water injection, although the effect on most engines with no other modification, like leaning out the mixture, appears to be rather limited or even negligible in some cases.
Some degree of control over the water injection is important. It needs to be injected only when the engine is heavily loaded and the throttle is wide open. Otherwise injecting water may simply drown the engine and cause it to quit.
Direct injection of water is possible. In a piston engine, this can be done late in the power stroke or during the exhaust stroke.

Use in automobiles

A limited number of road vehicles with large-displacement engines from manufacturers such as Chrysler have included water injection. Saab offered water injection for the Saab 99 Turbo. With the introduction of the intercooler the interest in water injection disappeared, but today, water injection is also of interest because it can potentially decrease nitrogen oxide (NOx) emissions in exhaust. The most common use of water injection today is in vehicles with aftermarket forced induction systems, such as turbochargers or superchargers. Such engines are commonly tuned with a narrower margin of safety from detonation and hence benefit greatly from the cooling effects of vaporized water.

now it says that having no other modification makes it to where there is almost no increase in FE but i'm planing on rebuilding my motor in the future with higher CR but right now i want it mostly for reduced nox emissions, and it will cool the EGR gases that can hit between 300 to 1000 degrees from what i read.

P.S. i don't believe wikipedia to be wrong but i don't expect it to be right on absolutly everything there's got to be something wrong in there somewhere but i don't see everything as being wrong just for the 1 or 2 things that are wrong i mean there only human after all.

[Joenavy85]

yeah, but water injection is made for high power, highly tuned, highly boosted engines. as far as using it as a filter for the EGR system i guess it would work, but is there really a need for it? or will it be more like extra weight due to lack of increased effectiveness? i understand what you're saying as far as using it as a filter, but i think i would just stick to what the manufacturer installed and not risk sucking water into my engine

[stovie]

it's only a quart jar what extra weight is that??? and also if your worried about sucking water the only way to suck enough water to hurt something is if you put the vacuum line to the bottom and the egr gas in line on the top.

[Joenavy85]

if you can explain how it can happen, it just goes to show you that it can. feel free to try it yourself, but i personally wouldn't try it

[user removed]

War emergency power in WW2 planes was highly over boosted supercharged with a life expectancy measured in minutes. Water injection kept the engines from literally blowing up.

I could see it in supercharged and turbocharged cars running very high boost levels, like 20 PSI and higher for maximum performance.

I have also used a Binks #7 paint gun to atomize water and blow it into the intake manifold to clean the carbon out of a few engines.

The old man tried it in a 1950 Dodge he bought in 1966 with 30 k original miles to get some carbon out of the engine.

Steam or highly vaporized water absorbs a lot of heat that would normally increase combustion pressure. It can also remove some carbon so you do not have to retard the timing to prevent pre ignition.

regards
Mech

[Milwaukee]

After read this It 50% BS.

I know that ALOT vapor in tank but problem is Ford use those check ball valve in tank so that won't work with vacuum it would pull check ball then it would died due no fuel go to engine due tank lock in vapor.

I believe that heat gas could improve mpg little.

Now we are in 10oF so gas burn QUICK. I have been look for electric heater on fuel filter but haven't found yet.