ZX40S Batteries popping like popcorn!

[rmay635703]

Originally Posted by stou0220

Well maybe we can figure out a way to get them up north. These are supposed to be unused batteries, but I am certain this is inaccurate. So much for getting what you were sold these days.

Actually I would be more hopefull if they were used, these batteries do not SIT well, under use they seem to live long lives so long as they aren't overdischarged or underdischarged and overcharged. After they sit you have to discharge them under a watchfull eye to a specific voltage and then recharged dozens of cycles to possibly bring them back.

Originally Posted by stou0220

So there is a dealer in Ohio that sells the transmission parts for this car? I heard the 2005-2006 models have the gearing in them while the 2007 and later had them stripped out except the one gear. If this option would provide better hill climbing with costing a fortune then I am definitely interested.

He has been selling junk transmissions from the offroad cousing Miles OR70 to get better gearing. Sadly I think he has run out which will mean mega price jump to order from china new. The trouble is only older OR70's had all the gears (but still no linkages), many still only have 2 of the gears which is still better than one gear like the zx40. And if you think you can find an older zx40 that has multiple gears forget about it, only maybe 5 including prototypes had 2 gears instead of one, likely the folks that have them won't give em up easily and I would estimate a few are sitting at Miles Corporate more or less permanently.

Originally Posted by stou0220

Maybe this is the start of another thread, but the thought had crossed my mind to just replace the motor and controller with something more powerful, something like the D&D ES-31B. Have any ZX40 owners done this that you all have heard of?

There is a motor D&D custom made to fit certain miles vehicles (aka has the really really strange shaft), I am uncertain if it is much better or not.

One issue is that there are 4 motors, the small 48v motor found on old ZX40's like my 05, the small 48v/72v motor found in some "Transitional" zx40s, the big 48v/72v motor found in the newer ZX40's and the older OR70 and the AC drive motor.

Being you have an 07 you probably already have the big motor anyway. Give me the serial and tag model info on your motor to humor me, I will see if its the same or different than my antique.

I somehow believe that my tinker toy 5hp motor is likely not easily upgradable and likely folks with the bigger motor already have one that is as big as will fit making the D&D moderately moot.

Only way to know would be to contact D&D and see what they think.

[stou0220]

I am not sure where to find the motor serial and tag, I don't see it on the motor. I wasn't aware that the shaft was so strange, although I am not surprised. Some custom lathe work should be able to solve that hurdle if necessary, although it is costly.

I am still learning with this project, but how wouldn't a bigger motor yield greater performance? For example, the D&D ES-31B is a 72-120 volt motor that is rated at 25 HP continuous, 40 HP Peak. I know range is sacrificed, but wouldn't this motor provide greater speed? Or are my gear ratios restricting too much to make a difference?

Regarding the batteries, I can't tell you what happened to them before I got them, but those 3 appear to still work. I may end up in the midwest sometime in the next 3-6 months, but if we can work out a way to migrate them to you before then I say let us do that!

[rmay635703]

Originally Posted by stou0220

I am not sure where to find the motor serial and tag, I don't see it on the motor. I wasn't aware that the shaft was so strange, although I am not surprised. Some custom lathe work should be able to solve that hurdle if necessary, although it is costly.

The shaft and the mount, the motor sits in between sort of a cradle that limits what you can do.

Originally Posted by stou0220

I am still learning with this project, but how wouldn't a bigger motor yield greater performance? For example, the D&D ES-31B is a 72-120 volt motor that is rated at 25 HP continuous, 40 HP Peak. I know range is sacrificed, but wouldn't this motor provide greater speed? Or are my gear ratios restricting too much to make a difference?

Yes a bigger motor has more power but only if it fits in there, which is questionable.

If your car is like mine, You will be turning around 6300rpm's give or take at 45-50mph. Changing your tire size helps a little but getting out of 2nd into 3rd gear is what makes a hi-speed miles feasable.

Originally Posted by stou0220

Regarding the batteries, I can't tell you what happened to them before I got them, but those 3 appear to still work. I may end up in the midwest sometime in the next 3-6 months, but if we can work out a way to migrate them to you before then I say let us do that!

Regardless of their condition I am willing to "try" messing with them the way I did on the 05's that came with this car, likely some will come back fully and some will probably die in a few months.

[stou0220]

I came across a gentleman who said he replaced the tranny on his ZX40 with a 2001-2005 Perodua Kenari transmission. Here is what he emailed me:

The tranny came from GB. It is Perodua Kenari 2000 to 2005 model. This is
basically the same car like Daihatsu Move, but cheaper and popular in GB.
I bought it just by picture - it fit in the space and the mounts. I needed
to drill 3 additional holes in the adaptor plate and grinded the CV joints
(developed slow transmit ion leak).
The gear stick came from WV Passat - it is with rods (not with cables).

I am going to contact him to try and get pictures. I thought you may be interested in a different potential solution to our speed limitations!

[rmay635703]

I am MOST CERTAINLY interested, however where is GB, around here that means Green Bay but I doubt that forgetting my foreign abbrev.

Anyway I knew Perodua made clones of Daihatsu vehicles, sadly I knew of no inexpensive way of getting Perodua parts much the same as Getting the transmission from Japan. The shipping is probably more than the transmission.

Anyway if you can find out how much this costs and how to get one, I'm in, especially if that guy does the necessary machining on the flex plate

And what in the heck is a Slow Ion leak and how is that fixed by machining?

Cheers
Ryan

Originally Posted by stou0220

I came across a gentleman who said he replaced the tranny on his ZX40 with a 2001-2005 Perodua Kenari transmission. Here is what he emailed me:

The tranny came from GB. It is Perodua Kenari 2000 to 2005 model. This is
basically the same car like Daihatsu Move, but cheaper and popular in GB.
I bought it just by picture - it fit in the space and the mounts. I needed
to drill 3 additional holes in the adaptor plate and grinded the CV joints
(developed slow transmit ion leak).
The gear stick came from WV Passat - it is with rods (not with cables).

I am going to contact him to try and get pictures. I thought you may be interested in a different potential solution to our speed limitations!

[stou0220]

Lol, GB is Great Britain I am afraid. And you are right, shipping for him was more than the part. Here is what he sent me last night:

I bought the tranny from Ebay - Perodua Kenari 2000 - 2005. 130 GBP and 200 GBP shipping. It took some additional holes to be drilled on the mounting
plate, but even it's a little bit bigger than the original - it fit. The
joints are slightly different, and I had to work them to fit (I have slow
leak from the tranny seals (where the u-joints go in it).
My setup is clutchless, and I am using mainly 4th and 5th gear. On 4th -
decent acceleration to about 32 mph, 5th - maintains 40 on flat, if you push
- goes 45mph. Max speed slight downhill - 52mph (so far). This is without
field weakening.

He also sent me some pics, if you want I can email them to you or post them somewhere.

[rmay635703]

Originally Posted by stou0220

My setup is clutchless, and I am using mainly 4th and 5th gear. On 4th -
decent acceleration to about 32 mph, 5th - maintains 40 on flat, if you push
- goes 45mph. Max speed slight downhill - 52mph (so far). This is without
field weakening.[/I]

He also sent me some pics, if you want I can email them to you or post them somewhere.

You can post them here if you like, I am uncertain why you would want a 5sp transmission when the 4 speed is likely fine, also something important, what voltage was his car?

When I did the calculations for the stock differential and transmission for a daihatsu move (aka 4sp) with my stock 48v motor. I came up with a top theoretical speed of about 52mph in 4th - losses or about 45mph. Apparently a 5sp ends up at about the same final drive ratio as the 4sp. The odd part is his comment about 4th gear, folks with a 72v miles typically can get up to about 40-45mph in 3rd gear of the stock 4sp transmission from china.

I can only guess he has a 48v car and his final drive ratio is the same on the 5sp as on the 4sp apparently.

If you can PM or Email me some pics / info along with this gentlemans contact I would like to speak with him. Oh and make sure he knows,
High gearing + field weakening = disaster. Field weakening is good when you need to rev the motor up to a higher RPM under a moderately light load, under heavy loads its just a bad idea. He would definately need an accurate ammeter to see what is going on, likely 5th is overampping his motor a bit already.

Cheers
Ryan

[stou0220]

Ryan,

I will PM the pics. I'm sure he won't mind, but let me ask him if it is OK to forward his information to you, just as a courtesy as he has been very generous in sharing his experience.

On a separate note, I tried a little experiment tonight with the car my friend has. We took my best spare battery, charged it up, and made his car 84-volt. I have heard of others doing this, but I don't know if anyone has done it with field weakening. The car gained 3-5 mph. The road we speed test on is a slight hill, about 3/4 mile long. We got the car about 46 MPH going down, and more impressively it accelerated to 37 MPH going up the hill. Previously it would only do ~33 MPH up that same hill. We don't if we will keep the car like this for a variety of reasons (motor health, charging, looks like hell), but it makes that car move!

[stou0220]

Well I took the 7th battery out, at least for now. The charger is only pushing ~87 volts, and it thinks the pack is charged when the batteries aren't fully charged. Also, it just looks like crap. I will have to see how much I miss that extra oomph before I decide if it is worth pursuing long term.

[rmay635703]

Originally Posted by stou0220

Ryan,

I will PM the pics. I'm sure he won't mind, but let me ask him if it is OK to forward his information to you, just as a courtesy as he has been very generous in sharing his experience.

We took my best spare battery, charged it up, and made his car 84-volt. I have heard of others doing this, but I don't know if anyone has done it with field weakening. The car gained 3-5 mph. The road we speed test on is a slight hill, about 3/4 mile long. We got the car about 46 MPH going down, and more impressively it accelerated to 37 MPH going up the hill.

My main concern is that the controller in there is only 72v, going past that usually causes the magic smoke, especially after a fresh charge, AKA bad idea batman.

Field weakening isn't a big deal, you just need to know what the motor is rated at and how much juice you are pressing through if you are running near the ragged edge and then do field weakening things break. Your motor is likely much larger than mine (erm 5hp tinker toy) so it likely will survive where mine won't

Thank You
Ryan