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Old 03-23-2014, 11:52 AM   #1 (permalink)
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$4,000 to Remanufacture a VX Engine?!?

Recently I'd asked what everyone thought about taking my 94 Civic VX to the local speed shop to have my engine completely remanufactured to OEM specs.

I've spoken with two local shops that specialize in Hondas; but one shop is asking $3,000 for just the labor alone while the other shop is asking $4000 for both labor and parts, plus accessory components if required. They did however ask if I was pulling out and installing the engine, so that may make the difference in the price.

In lieu of all of that, I'm considering other options. For example, has anyone ever heard of OE Engines Direct? OE Engines Direct - Remanufactured Engines for Mechanics and Automotive Professionals. They claim to provide better service than Jasper Engines in addition to sending out their work to professional shops throughout the country. They quoted me roughly $2100 to remanufacture my engine to OEM specs, plus a 12,000 mile warranty. I'd be interested to know what everyone thinks of them.

http://oeenginesdirect.com/

The other option provide to me by a local mechanic was to have the cylinder bores cleaned,the piston rings replaced, the the head worked on and to get a valve job. However; an engine building instructor at the local technical college once said to me that completely remanufacturing the engine is the only way to go.....that too, I'd like to hear what everyone thinks.

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Old 03-23-2014, 12:45 PM   #2 (permalink)
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IMO

One thing I don't like about rebuilding the Honda engines is after boring the cylinders the cylinders themselves loose their OEM integrity. The way Honda treats the bores from the factory their only good for stock bore specs. The Honda engines just don't take to well to boring.They end up wearing out faster after boring.You could have sleeves installed but this becomes a whole other expense and problem if the tech has never work on Honda engines.

If it was me I would tear the engine down and see what the bore taper is? I have a couple blocks that show no taper at all. At that point I would de-glaze the cylinders and run stock pistons with stock type rings. Re-con the rods and have the crank turned. New OEM Honda oil pump, bearings etc.

This what I did on my last D16Z6 Honda engine. Less then 1% leak-down and no oil consumption. Should go past 300K easily with good maintenance.
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Last edited by pgfpro; 03-23-2014 at 12:55 PM..
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Old 03-23-2014, 01:23 PM   #3 (permalink)
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WHY are you wanting to spend money on rebuilding it?

The money spent will NOT be recovered by better gas mileage.
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Old 03-23-2014, 05:13 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mista Bone View Post
WHY are you wanting to spend money on rebuilding it?

The money spent will NOT be recovered by better gas mileage.
Just preparing for the future. The car has over 250,000 as previously mentioned in my last post. I'm just trying to get ahead of a problem before I'm stuck with one.
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Old 03-23-2014, 05:38 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Do a leakdown test to check the check ring condition. I would never hone and re-ring and engine that had any ridge at the top of the cylinders. You will break the rings and destroy the rebuild. I had a piston on my shop counter that had broken a ring and burned a groove down the side of the piston to the oil control ring.

Cylinder walls don't wear evenly and if they are not bored parallel the rings will expand and contract as they ride up and down the bores taper. If you tear it down and the ring end gap is still in specs and there is no ridge at the top, then you didn't need to tear it down, unless the rings got gummed up and stopped sealing properly. In that case I have seen some good techs just clean everything up and put it back together and it worked fine with no measureable oil consumption. Very rarely you see that happen.

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Old 03-23-2014, 07:35 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Why not buy a low mile engine and have that tuned instead of fully rebuilt?
Do things like balance all of the moving parts to be as close as possible, replace the parts that do wear.
An engine with less then 80,000 miles on it will cost you $400 to $500, you could even install an engine like that as is other then a few things like new timing belt and still come out spending less then $1,000 without you lifting a finger other then to write a check.
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Old 03-23-2014, 07:46 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryland View Post
Why not buy a low mile engine and have that tuned instead of fully rebuilt?
Do things like balance all of the moving parts to be as close as possible, replace the parts that do wear.
An engine with less then 80,000 miles on it will cost you $400 to $500, you could even install an engine like that as is other then a few things like new timing belt and still come out spending less then $1,000 without you lifting a finger other then to write a check.
That's sort of what I ended up doing with the White Gnat last year when the original engine went bad. "Plan A" was to get a valve job, but when an oil starvation problem destroyed the freshly refurbished head, my mechanic found a 7000 mile engine in a local junk yard and installed that for free. That's the engine I'm now so pleased with and hitting 60 mpg with. Plenty of power when I need it, too.
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Old 03-23-2014, 07:56 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Mechanic View Post
Do a leakdown test to check the check ring condition. I would never hone and re-ring and engine that had any ridge at the top of the cylinders. You will break the rings and destroy the rebuild. I had a piston on my shop counter that had broken a ring and burned a groove down the side of the piston to the oil control ring.

Cylinder walls don't wear evenly and if they are not bored parallel the rings will expand and contract as they ride up and down the bores taper. If you tear it down and the ring end gap is still in specs and there is no ridge at the top, then you didn't need to tear it down, unless the rings got gummed up and stopped sealing properly. In that case I have seen some good techs just clean everything up and put it back together and it worked fine with no measureable oil consumption. Very rarely you see that happen.

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To clarify my post if you have a ridge at the top of the bore your cylinder bore taper is going to be through the roof. Known fact!!! I have rebuilt a ton of Honda engines and only have seen a handful that had a ridge? All the ones with the ridge I would throw away and I would get a different block. There's not to much meat on a Honda stock sleeve.
Example:
My sons stock 350,000 miles engine (no ridge) that we rebuilt over 5 years ago and ran 11.0x @ 134mph 1/4 mile, on stock pistons and new rings with just de-glazed bores and new rod bearings. Burns no oil, but brakes a lot of transmissions.


Back in the 80's when we were rebuilding muscle car engine's we would use a bore ridge reamer tool to take out the ridge. Not the best way of doing things, but it was a down and dirty inexpensive way to do a rebuild. I never seen a broken ring from not boring a block after the ridge was taken out??? Sounds like someone doesn't have a clue what their doing? Or most likely broke the ring during installing?

On the VX Honda engines with high mileage I have seen a lot of piston rings gummed up do to the EGR, that we nick named "early gum rebuild" valve, in combination with the oil separator "black box" under the intake.

Anyway a leak down and compression test are a must in your case. If both test are good and you are burning oil the oil rings are gummed up and not working. Gummed up oil rings will not show up with a leak-down and compression test.
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Last edited by pgfpro; 03-23-2014 at 08:04 PM..
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Old 03-23-2014, 08:28 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Im all for fixing things right, but it is a 20 year old car. I could buy multiple spare cars with that rebuild budget.
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Old 03-23-2014, 10:12 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pgfpro View Post
To clarify my post if you have a ridge at the top of the bore your cylinder bore taper is going to be through the roof. Known fact!!! I have rebuilt a ton of Honda engines and only have seen a handful that had a ridge? All the ones with the ridge I would throw away and I would get a different block. There's not to much meat on a Honda stock sleeve.
Example:
My sons stock 350,000 miles engine (no ridge) that we rebuilt over 5 years ago and ran 11.0x @ 134mph 1/4 mile, on stock pistons and new rings with just de-glazed bores and new rod bearings. Burns no oil, but brakes a lot of transmissions.


Back in the 80's when we were rebuilding muscle car engine's we would use a bore ridge reamer tool to take out the ridge. Not the best way of doing things, but it was a down and dirty inexpensive way to do a rebuild. I never seen a broken ring from not boring a block after the ridge was taken out??? Sounds like someone doesn't have a clue what their doing? Or most likely broke the ring during installing?

On the VX Honda engines with high mileage I have seen a lot of piston rings gummed up do to the EGR, that we nick named "early gum rebuild" valve, in combination with the oil separator "black box" under the intake.

Anyway a leak down and compression test are a must in your case. If both test are good and you are burning oil the oil rings are gummed up and not working. Gummed up oil rings will not show up with a leak-down and compression test.
"Sounds like someone doesn't have a clue what they are doing. Or most likely broke the ring during installation".

Gramatically incorrect, and character assasination. Violation of forum rules.

I generally avoid degrading myself by even answering statements that attempt to attack my knowledge and experience. It's a common form of propaganda called "killing the messenger".

You can read my full response on your "Talon" thread. The one where you freely admit my advice against making public statements that prove emissions violations apparently were taken seriously by yourself. You apparently considered that advice to be important enough to have posts and threads deleted on this board, then come back here with this statement.

Mech

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