Ben Nelson's Electro-Metro Build thread

[MPaulHolmes]

Nice and clean! doesn't it feel good to get little irritating things taken care of! It looks like you got the hole just the right size, so no worry about anything getting through there.

[Christ]

Could you go for a slightly larger hole, with a rubber grommet "sealed" to the conduit? That would probably hold in better than caulking would, IMO.

This comes from the last year I spent as a Union Apprentice Pointer/Caulker/Cleaner. I still have a full set of Caulking tools, including a 2 foot caulk gun.

[bennelson]

Keeping in mind Paul's 144V Open Source Controller Project, I wanted to see what it would take to up my Metro to 144 volts.

Currently, I am running 6 batteries for a 72 volt system.

My batteries weigh 70 lbs each.

That means the batteries I am using right now weigh 420 lbs. 6 more batteries would be an additional 420 for a total of 840 lbs of lead.

The GVW marked on the door frame says 2590 lbs.

When I weighed the car with the ICE in it at the landscaping scale, it clocked in at 1780 lbs.

I think the conversion to electric (with the exception of the batteries) comes to about the same weight as the original. The motor I put in actually weighed less than the engine I pulled out. I also pulled off the gas tank, radiator and other bits, but then I added in a battery charger and some front steel reinforcement for the "radiator-position" batteries.

So, I am guessing the car frame weighs pretty much the same with the ICE or the EV system.

If it does, that means I have 2590 lbs - 1780 lbs (weight of car) for driver, passenger, and batteries.

810 lbs to work with comes pretty close to twelve of these lead-acid batteries, however, that's WITHOUT a driver or passenger.

I weigh about 190 lbs in winter clothing. That puts me plus 12 batteries OVER the gross vehicle weight.

Hmmm...

Well, I am still in the mood for experimenting, so lets load up some batteries.

I put the "second-string" of batteries in the back of the car. I could fit only 3 on the floor (trying to bring the weight forward) but the other 3 had to go on the back seat.


(Note that while the batteries look a bit strewn about, they were all nicely strapped down before driving. Once upon a time I had a bad experience with a loose flooded battery, and now I know better! )

I measured the height from the ground to the center directly above the rear wheel, both before AND after loading the batteries.

On the back, I lost 1&1/8 inches. Pushing on the bumper showed that there was minimal suspension left. It did go up an down, but not much at all.

I took a ride down the street, and found that acceleration was a bit more sluggish, and did pull more than the usual amps to get going.

Braking distance increased slightly, but was still no problem. I tested the brakes with the vacuum assist deactivated and found that it was no problem stopping the car without power as well.

I wanted to make a video of the extra-heavy ride, but the cold was effecting my tiny camcorder battery as well, and it kept dying on me.



If I want to upgrade to 144V with these batteries, I will NEED to improve the rear suspension. I might also be able to fit another battery under the hood, two if I rearrange some things up there. Shifting battery weight to the front would help some. I can see why many scratch-built EVs use a "tunnel" of batteries straight down the middle.

It may make more sense to go with 120 volts. That would save me 140 lbs and the space needed for two batteries.

If I did upgrade to 120 or 144V, I would love to cut out the underside of the back seat and install a battery box below it. The center of gravity on the car feels great as it is, and a low battery box would REALLY make it stick to the ground.

The brakes seemed fine. I don't think I would need to do anything with them, accept maybe replace brake pads more often.


Since I finally got the registration sticker in the mail a couple days ago, I figured it was time to put that on the rear plate.

There were so many old registration stickers on there that I had to scrape all the old ones off with a chisel.

I had grabbed a wet paper towel to clean the license plate for a dirt-free spot to put the sticker.

When I opened the garage door, I had the wet paper towel in my left hand and opened the latch with my right and lifted the door. As I did this, the paper towel touched the door, flash-froze to it, and was ripped out of my hand as the door opened.


[Paper towel frozen to the door. It may be sunny, but it's -1℉]

I'm really starting to get sick of this cold. If only I had a passive solar garage....

When I put the registration sticker on the license plate, it broke in half from the cold. I just lined up both halves as best I could and stuck it on there.

That's it though, the one last thing I ever had to do to make the car a 100% official government stamp of approval A-OK road-worthy vehicle.

That's one more EV on the road.

[Demon-Hemi]

very nice man, have you thought about an undercoating to take care of that rust under there

[MPaulHolmes]

120v would be a nice gentle test on the controller. When you get it, it will be completely untested above 72v. I'm sure it will be fine at 144v, but you know. They ARE 200v components, so I'm not worried, but I wouldn't cry about a 120v test first. hehe.

I love all the pictures and videos that you do. It adds such richness to your explanations! They are so professional!

[order99]

About that Passive Solar garage...

Does your household consume a lot of soda? Start favoring cans over 2-liter bottles for awhile-or ask your neighbors to save theirs for you, uncrushed.

Use a Router or drill to cut 1" holes in the bottoms of each can. fasten together columns of cans (top opening to bottom opening)about 5 ft tall. Seal the top and bottom of each column. At the top of two columns cut holes in one side and join the columns together at the opening-at the bottom the second column bore a hole and match another column. Essentially you have a 5x5 radiator when you're done, closed off externally but joined internally with the interior looping in 'S' formation vertically:

[/\/\/\/\/\] (more or less).

Once you have the columns fastened into a radiator(Cold Weld,Epoxy or Fiberglass are all good for this)determine a Front position-bore a single 1" hole in the side of each can in the Bottom Front of your radiator. Now build a frame that fits the cans snugly-I used 2x4s and a plywood backing for mine, but you can get as fancy or as simple as you like. Paint or stain the frame to weatherproof it, then line the inside with foil. Paint the Radiator black, let dry, insert over the foil and fasten a sheet of glass on the top.

Open up a 2" hole in the bottom of the frame and fasten a short PVC (Inflow pipe) either leaving the pipe open or adding a fancy one-way valve for efficiency(mine just uses a mesh covering). Insert another pipe (Outflow) at the top of the frame. Place the box somewhere sunny-if this isn't directly against the outer garage wall make sure to wrap the Outflow pipe.

As soon as the sun heats the Box the hot air will rise and be trapped inside the top of the radiator, be pushed out the bottom holes by more rising air and float out of the Outflow pipe. To maximize the efficiency of the airflow you will want to place a tiny, cheap fan either at the Inflow pipe pulling or the Outflow pipe pushing-a PV powered microfan would be perfect for this, though I used a replaceable Dollar Tree fan for mine. Find an entry point from the Outflow pipe to the garage and you're done...estimated costs will be from $0 to $50 or so depending on how much you have lying around, and a few hours of work broken by a few hours of watching paint dry. When Summer hits, cover the Box with a tarp and place a cap on your Outflow pipe.

Compared to your EV work this is child's play. This design is by no means original, credit goes to, er, whichever Poster on whatever Forum I was reading at the time....

[Christ]

Order 99 - I'd like to see that in my recycling thread. It's a great re-use for something that most people just take for granted.

[order99]

Sure no problem...Go Go Gadget Cut-N-Paste!

[Christ]

Thanks! I plan on making that thread into a sort of itemized list to show people who are looking at it exactly what they're throwing away... and what they could be doing with it! Everything anyone can think of that is a re-use for ANYTHING will add to it.

Ben - for a Garage, one of the first steps is to seal up the drafty bits. There is no point in giving it any kind of heat if you can't contain the heat you're providing.

Anything can really be used for insulation, the idea is to get as many small, immobile air bubbles as you can between the inside and the outside. Any type of reactive foam will help with this, as it forms stationary air bubbles as it dries. Common myth is that density is a good thing in insulations - it's not. Just stuffing R34 on top of R34 is actually HARMING your efficiency... the stuff is at a specific density already, so that it operates near it's peak efficiency when installed into a properly sized gap.

If you're really interested in recycling, you can make your own insulation easily - Your local salvation army office throws away (that's right, even the SA throws lots of stuff away) any donation that isn't "suitable" for sale or charity. Most of that "stuff" is old clothes that might have holes, etc in them. Give them a call. They probably won't just give you the stuff, but you can get it REALLY cheaply... cents per pound cheap.

Shredding denim (a great insulator) into a grainy powderish consistency yields excellent insulation results.

If you do plan on just insulating and working on what you already have, but making your own insulation isn't for you, I would caution you to stay away from Fiberglass insulation. When you breathe the stuff in, it sticks in your alveoli. It NEVER comes back out. It's very unhealthy for anyone exposed to it. Instead, try carded wool from sheep! Living in Wisconsin, I'm sure there are plenty of sheep, goats, and alpaca near you, you might be able to buy "seconds" of wool very cheaply. Remember to card/wash it and air it out though!

You may also be able to just buy wool insulation. If that's the case, it's usually pretty economical... comparable to fiberglass.

[bennelson]

Oh my, suddenly all the advice on garages.

An insulated garage is part of the long-term plan for electric vehicles, other eco-transporation, and workspace.

"Sealing up the drafty bits" is an understatement. I have to start with keeping small animals and rivers out.

My garage is on the nexus of geological ley-lines. Seriously, I found a "Soil Survey of Waukesha County" which points out the fact that seven different types of earth meet at a point directly under my garage, thus heaving up and cracking the concrete.

On the one day we had so far this winter that was warm enough to melt snow, there was practically a stream running through the cracks in my garage's concrete floor.

No, simple insulating will not be enough. The garage needs to be rebuilt, from the foundation up. (Preferably on a very cleverly designed floating I-beam design.)

But as I was saying, that' part of the long term plan. I do have some fantasies of strawbale walls, a green roof, solar panels, or something similar.

If I have an electric car and a bio-diesel truck, it only makes sense to keep them in a green garage!