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Old 08-15-2014, 12:22 PM   #21 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gregsfc View Post
I think that my intent was absolutely misunderstood.
I agree. I had to go back to even find what post was being debated since whenever I read it I see nothing but normal discussion of opinion. Certainly nothing to get all defensive about.

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Old 08-16-2014, 12:34 AM   #22 (permalink)
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I accept your expertise. Just I see folks getting into personally issues a bit too much for my taste. Sorry, I don't want to be a drag.
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Old 08-16-2014, 06:04 AM   #23 (permalink)
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Absolutely nothing personal with Craig. I spoke with him at the event; he was cordial, he has passion, he has presented some fantastic and inventive concepts for motorcycles, is a true hall of famer, and best of all, he keeps doing the work to keep these events going and tries his best to create some sort of focus in this country on fuel efficiency for two and three wheelers.

I have a criticism though about the lack of inclusiveness for different concepts and welcome spirit of the events that could make them so much better; much more participated; and much more reported on by the press. I was surprised at the AMA event that there was no press at the pre meeting the night before; the pre meeting before the event; during the event; and only one article printed about the Sunday ceremony.

The issues I've brought up, especially the grocery bag test, have been brought up many, many times to Craig by those who show up at the event and then realize it's not designed for the regular motorcyclist. Some of these issues are brought up and defended by Craig on his website. He has a response and a justification for the way he is doing things. I don't believe I could convince him that he has "erred". It's not as if I could tell him about it and he would think he's erred. What he is doing is fine if that's all he wants out of it. He's the only one doing it that I know of, and it's his show. But the result of this limited scope is that five or six guys come to compete every event; three or four show up with stock bikes just to ride but not really compete; most often for the first and only time. Usually a three or four wheeler will show up for demonstration purposes; a few big bikes with riders will show up just to see what it is all about and just because it's an opportunity for a group ride that draws attention out on the highway when folks see those streamlined machines and this gives them another chance to show off their big chromed machines.

This website being a discussion forum, I'm simply discussing my belief that if Craig decided to make this event more inclusive; about more than what it is about; maybe it would draw more interest and participation. It is not meant as a personal attack. Just my opinion which itself may be flawed. I'm not sure I'm right. It might still be fledgling along even with more classes of winners and a more welcomed spirit to draw high mpg vehicles, but I do feel like what he is doing is not working as intended. And that is to get the world interested in streamlined motorcycles and trikes and scooter for the future of transportation. Someone told me that in Europe, they know of only one person doing this.

Last edited by gregsfc; 08-16-2014 at 06:11 AM..
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Old 08-16-2014, 09:56 AM   #24 (permalink)
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We should probably continue this over here and leave Ben's thread alone.
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http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthrea...ice-29352.html
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Old 08-16-2014, 12:29 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Agreed. So Ben my input is to look at using honeycomb aluminum for bulkheads, crush zones, and a safety shell as found in modern cars but without the roof. The head piece to be faired as per Alan Smith's. The main bulkhead behind the back should be able to withstand 3 times the gross weight with the rider. Width is going to be around 26" so length will be 3 to 5 times that. A low nose and a high tail with curved sides seems to be the best for stability to date. By using elliptical bulkheads and conic sections we could avoid the compound curves that are so hard to form. The honeycomb can be used to form curves by making cuts to the inside. See "Successful Composite Techniques" by Keith Noakes for info on cut and fold methods. I have looked at a number of sailplane plans and my favorite is found at www.vintagesailplaner.com/Sheet1bis-9.pdf - just reduce the drawing view to see the whole sheet. For our purposes end the shell at the #6 bulkhead either as a kammback or taper to a point. Size the shell so that the canopy top comes to the shoulder then form a narrow windscreen and helmet fairing. Given the skill you have shown on your previous project you should do well.
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Old 08-17-2014, 05:05 PM   #26 (permalink)
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Here's the bike. I like the headlight and windshield, but I think the rest of the front end needs lots of work. I tried loweringthe handlebars using the stock clip ons, and found them to be not to be easily changeable. I will be looking for a set of adjustable clipons soon. I did lower the front end about 1/2 inch this morning, it mght be possible to lower it a little more without worry. I will be removing the front fairing sometime this week to figgure out how best to mount a better fairing. I will be shaping fiberglass over styrofoam as I have in the past. I think I can keep the bike under 22inches wide, and 8feet long. I'll also be going for light weight. Bulkheads as safety features probably won't work, since ill be riding in a tuck and the tail will only be about 6-8inches high.
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Old 08-17-2014, 06:15 PM   #27 (permalink)
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How much was the bike? My dealer had 5 left over 2013 CBR250R's that they gave away for $3,400.
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Old 08-18-2014, 12:37 PM   #28 (permalink)
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It would be nice to keep the iconic headlight of the CBR250R. I am planning on raising the windshield with a carbonate sheet across and under the mirrors and going narrower with some clip on bars. A head forward position with your eyes peeking just over the screen creates a magic blow drier effect which blows any rain right off your face shield.
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Excellent info from Aerohead shows that Kamming the tail starts a big loss at anything more than 10% of the airfoil length. He has shown that even a very short fineness airfoil is much better than a long airfoil Kammed at 40%. And a round nosed cone with straight sides is fairly poor also compared to even a much shorter airfoil. We need to make room for the license plate. So if I were going to start over and form foam mold for my bike I would shape the side view to match the aero template starting just in front of the front wheel, truncating at the back. And make the top view as a non truncated short airfoil along the bottom of the bike, tapering up to a 9 inch wide Kamm at the top of the tail for added storage, and a place to mount the license plate and rear flush mount led turn signals.
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Old 08-18-2014, 02:46 PM   #29 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bschloop View Post
I think I can keep the bike under 22inches wide, and 8feet long.
That seems like it might be a little bit narrow, unless you are planning on a small/slender rider. You don't want bits of rider hanging outside of the bodywork. Plus, a sturdy riding jacket with some padding/armor in the shoulder can add a couple of inches to the shoulder.

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Old 08-18-2014, 03:14 PM   #30 (permalink)
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Any rider gets a lot narrower in a head forward position if you have narrow handle bars. The foot pegs become the widest part of the bike.

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