The climate change consensus extends beyond climate scientists

[RedDevil]

In my opinion Trumps timescale is strange too.
It will only take several thousands of years, not millions of years, for most of the carbon dioxide to get bound in sediments etc.
The climate may be off whack and remain in an altered state by then, but that will no longer be driven by the residue of our current emissions.

Anyway, Trump's stance may work out for the best, as it defuses the sentiment that the west pushes the developing world to lower carbon emissions, stifling their growth.
China is outpacing the US as a leading economy, so China going green will have more effect on the climate than whatever the US does.

[sendler]

China is forecast to be burning more carbon in 2040. Not less. India will be burning 2X.
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[RedDevil]

All the more reason for them (too) to strive for efficiency improvements and green energy sources.

[sendler]

These charts include all of the possible "striving" for wind and solar. The problem is that the scale of our consumption dwarfs the build out of alternatives due to their very poor density. World solar and wind is still less than 2% of total energy. Can't even mention storage.

[oil pan 4]

It is a hoax when the belivers are telling us "there's going to be more major land falling hurricanes like Harvey, Florence, Mike" and the long term trends are not supporting that at all.
The way the segment was presented was "it's happening now" not "we think this is what's going to start happening".

Then sample size. How do we know the all the 1885 to 1930 hurricanes, aren't actually normal. Or maybe it's exceptionally rare happening only once every few hundred years.

[RedDevil]

Personally I don't see how climate change would cause more hurricanes. If both the sea and the air heat up equally there isn't more power in the system to cause hurricanes.
So I'm not convinced there is a relationship. Global warming is a fact, but hurricanes may not be the best instrument to measure it.

To filter on just landfall hurricanes reduces the sample size and increases ambiguity - do narrow passes count, and when? Also, each hurricane takes energy out of the system, without the non-landfall hurricanes energy would build up to extreme levels.
The effect often spreads out over very large areas so each hurricane anywhere in the world should count.

[oil pan 4]

I would believe man made climate change caused more hurricanes it if the 1885 to now land falling hurricane data was exactly backwards from what it is.

We couldn't really track hurricanes anything like we do now until about the 1960s.
This what's so good about the land fall hurricanes data, it goes back to the hight of the industrial revolution and no one can skew the data in their favor. That's why the man made global warming belivers hate it so much.

[freebeard]

Given the lack of the Consensus this thread is [allegedly] about, one would think I could get some support for the idea of ruggedizing infrastructure against both extremes.

[redpoint5]

Originally Posted by freebeard

Given the lack of the Consensus this thread is [allegedly] about, one would think I could get some support for the idea of ruggedizing infrastructure against both extremes.

We live in a disposable culture, so preservation is not a big priority. If something gets ruined, just throw it away and get another one (relationships too).

[gone-ot]

Originally Posted by redpoint5

We live in a disposable culture, so preservation is not a big priority. If something gets ruined, just throw it away and get another one (relationships too).

Yep, R&R used to mean remove & repair, now it means remove & replace.