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Old 03-06-2019, 01:09 PM   #5301 (permalink)
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factory farm quanta

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Originally Posted by redpoint5 View Post
Part of diversity (of humans) is sustaining a large number of them at various levels of health, genetic predisposition, skills, and environment. Returning to less productive means of farming will certainly cause the death of many people. That may be good from a "survival of the fittest" standpoint, but it's not humane and works against diversity.

Current factory farming is a miracle and works wonderfully to produce an unprecedented amount of food. The world is nearing toward practically no starvation, which I'll probably see within my lifetime.

Nothing is sustainable, and the need for eventual adaptation to changing circumstances is assured. It may be that some of your proposed solutions are what is needed, but that comes at the expense of increased labor and energy inputs. We'll need to solve the energy and labor problems first.

There's this romantic idea that a small local farm with a guy gathering produce in his pickup truck is more energy efficient than the huge combines that harvest produce and the large trucks/ships that send it to far reaches of the world, but that simply isn't the case. Enormous machines are more energy efficient than a bunch of smaller, less energy intensive machines. The number of miles the product has to travel is almost irrelevant.

Besides that, who's going to give up fresh produce in the winter? We'll all go back to boiling/canning our fruits and veggies to make it through the 10 months of the year the produce isn't locally available?
This 'reality' is only germane,within the context/conditions with which it presently operates.
There is mounting evidence that we must either modify, or abandon our present farm practices,as what fails to reach the current spreadsheets,will make the difference of our undoing.
And we continue to breed additional victims.

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Old 03-06-2019, 01:32 PM   #5302 (permalink)
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ocean flow-dynamo

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Originally Posted by freebeard View Post
Robots don't need to pull weeds, they can just poke them back underground while they're still sprouts too small to grasp.

Hydoponics is demonstrable technology. Pick and place robots are a thing. It's just a matter of stacking them vertically.

Ontopic: Suspicious 0bservers: We're all gonna die dept.:

Abrupt global events in the Earth’s history: a physics perspective - GregoryRyskin
https://arxiv.org/ftp/astro-ph/papers/0312/0312617.pdf

The world ends not with a bang or whimper, just a bad smell.

Data-driven model of the solar corona above an active region - J. Warnecke and H. Peter
https://arxiv.org/pdf/1903.00455.pdf

Solar fusion has the heat of a compost pile.
Saltwater is conductive.If a voltage potential was ever present,it would immediately flow to zero-potential,equilibrium through the water to an earth ground,anywhere along it's lithospheric boundary.
We know,from ocean floor,transoceanic cable research that Earth produces no potential,nor magnetic field in a 'Faraday' conductor adjacent to the would-be ocean 'dynamo'.The absence of voltage and magnetic field is observable scientific evidence that an ocean dynamo is a figment of the imagination.
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As to the Sun,Earth's climate is only 17-kilometers tall.There are some weak insolation and long-wave radiative couplings above the troposphere,but mostly what happens to our climate is contained between the ocean surface and 17-kilometers of atmosphere.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Space weather plays a minute role,with respect to cloud condensation nuclei and albedo,but they've been included within the climate models for decades,and short of a mass coronal ejection or gamma-ray burst from a local nova event,space weather doesn't mean doodly-squat to climate.
Communications? Yes.
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Old 03-06-2019, 01:46 PM   #5303 (permalink)
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For those who deny the science - how do you explain the facts?

Facts like record high global temperature averages?
How do you explain the rapid loss of ice?
How do you explain the melting tundra, and eruptions of gases?
How do you explain the ocean becoming more acidic?
Why is carbon dioxide at about 413ppm?
Why are plants and animals migrating to new / different regions?
Why are we seeing rapid extinctions?
Why is sea level rising?
Why is there more evaporation?
Why are tropical diseases spreading?
Why are we seeing so many people migrating?
Why are walruses and polar bears starving?
Why are lobsters migrating?
Why is plankton about half of what it was in 1960?
Why have about 70% of flying insects disappeared, since 1989?
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Old 03-06-2019, 01:52 PM   #5304 (permalink)
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speculation

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Originally Posted by oil pan 4 View Post
The cost of "inaction" is purely speculation.
Going to about 6 times gdp in debit the country will financially implode and there will be no new green deal bs.
There will be no money to buy solar panels or put up wind turbines and improved building efficiency.
Everyone will be poor and using dirty energy like russia after the fall of the soviet union or Venezuela.
*If the CBO,and those who subscribe to their logic, dismiss the trillions of dollars price tag as being too great a price,it implies that the CBO has also run a complete cost-benefit analysis which illustrates the cost of mitigation.How else could they argue the difference?
I'm only asking for the other Dollar value.
How can a democracy work without an informed populace? It under girds the entire premise of the United States.
Some economists value Earth's goods and services at $33-trillion a year.If we stand to lose these services,what have we gained by keeping Bertha's Kitty Boutique and Powder Milk Biscuits in business?
PS Who runs the CBO? Are they a presidential appointee,former lobbyist? Have they an agenda to sully the scientific voice as per the last 50-years.And are the hard-working souls at the CBO under gag-order not to say a thing which undermines the appointee's agenda?Like they've done with NASA?
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Last edited by aerohead; 03-06-2019 at 02:01 PM.. Reason: spelling and add data
 
Old 03-06-2019, 02:00 PM   #5305 (permalink)
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For those who deny economics - how do you explain the facts?

How do you explain highest life expectancy in world history?
How do you explain most wealth per capita than ever?
How do you explain more leisure time than ever?
How do you explain lowest violent mortality than ever?
How do you explain ever decreasing rates of hunger?
How do you explain declining child labor?
How do you explain lowest percent of income spent on food than ever?
How do you explain increasing rates of formal education?
How do you explain literacy at an all time high?

It's not clear that increasing levels of CO2 pose a serious threat to any of the typical ways in which we measure human well-being.
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Old 03-06-2019, 02:31 PM   #5306 (permalink)
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The second law of thermodynamics and transparent accounting for all energy inputs/per unit output will decide the day.
PV and wind power make up around 3% of the 4 trillion kwh of energy the US uses its already been decided.
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Old 03-06-2019, 03:30 PM   #5307 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redpoint5 View Post
For those who deny economics - how do you explain the facts?

How do you explain highest life expectancy in world history?
How do you explain most wealth per capita than ever?
How do you explain more leisure time than ever?
How do you explain lowest violent mortality than ever?
How do you explain ever decreasing rates of hunger?
How do you explain declining child labor?
How do you explain lowest percent of income spent on food than ever?
How do you explain increasing rates of formal education?
How do you explain literacy at an all time high?

It's not clear that increasing levels of CO2 pose a serious threat to any of the typical ways in which we measure human well-being.
Assuming this describes Sweden? It fits them better than the USA.
And Swedens carbon emissions are below world average - and getting lower even.
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Old 03-06-2019, 03:37 PM   #5308 (permalink)
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Yes. Sweden's electicity is 50% hydro and 50% nuclear.
 
Old 03-06-2019, 03:38 PM   #5309 (permalink)
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CO2

Quote:
Originally Posted by redpoint5 View Post
For those who deny economics - how do you explain the facts?

How do you explain highest life expectancy in world history?
How do you explain most wealth per capita than ever?
How do you explain more leisure time than ever?
How do you explain lowest violent mortality than ever?
How do you explain ever decreasing rates of hunger?
How do you explain declining child labor?
How do you explain lowest percent of income spent on food than ever?
How do you explain increasing rates of formal education?
How do you explain literacy at an all time high?

It's not clear that increasing levels of CO2 pose a serious threat to any of the typical ways in which we measure human well-being.
It's not clear that increasing levels of CO2 do not pose a serious threat to any of the typical ways in which we measure human well-being?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
The cost of what you call the 'typical ways' we measure human well being may be the habitability of the planet we all live on.
It will be the effects of increasing levels of CO2 that pose a serious threat,not the CO2.(context)
Increasing levels of heat pose no threat to someone already dead from heat exposure.
A complete diet of deep-fried butter cannot alter the life expectancy of a morbidly-obese person already on the brink of a massive heart attack.
And as economists are want to say,'the closer you are to death,the less more life you have,but there's still more.'
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
There's a growing body of observed, empirical evidence, which suggests, with high confidence,a probability that we have only limited time to arrest,and reverse greenhouse gas emissions,or it will be a global existential situation we're facing.
And in the context of a single human lifetime,these effects will be irreversible.
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Old 03-06-2019, 03:42 PM   #5310 (permalink)
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decided

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Originally Posted by oil pan 4 View Post
PV and wind power make up around 3% of the 4 trillion kwh of energy the US uses its already been decided.
Please read permalink#5295 on page 30,and see if you can say the same thing twice.

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