Do Hybrids Really Make Sense?

[user removed]

I think you can see from the used prices the hurdles faced by 10+ year old hybrid purchasers. Once the 8-10 year battery warranty expires, the used car value drops to or below that of a non hybrid but otherwise similar vehicle. Add another 10 years and they will all be gone, with few exceptions.

regards
mech

[P-hack]

I don't follow your causality there. given how "wimpy" hybrid batteries tend to be, the costs aren't terrible. And replacement is reasonably simple to do on a prius, most people can't even change their own oil though. So using sale cost to infer reliability (when taxi's are going 300k in a prius) is a bit wonky.

How Long Will Hybrid Car Batteries Last? april 2014:
"retail price for a new hybrid battery is $2589; with labor, it should be less than $3500 total.

I'm not complaining about the low cost, I'll gladly take advantage of it. just not going to agree that it means it is unreliable. The electronic portion is the most reliable part about it.

As for "making sense", it depends on the driver and alternatives. I do better hypermiling with an econobox 5 speed, but do ok with the prius. Have gotten good enough with the prius that the difference is marginal. Your typical driver will do better with the hybrid of course.

[nimblemotors]

Originally Posted by Old Mechanic

I think you can see from the used prices the hurdles faced by 10+ year old hybrid purchasers. Once the 8-10 year battery warranty expires, the used car value drops to or below that of a non hybrid but otherwise similar vehicle. Add another 10 years and they will all be gone, with few exceptions.

regards
mech

Not really the case here. Bluebook prices are not right.
Even the ones with bad batteries still fetch over $1,000.
How many old cars with blown engines fetch over $1,000?
There are now aftermarket prius batteries at much less cost, Dorman brand $1400, and expect that to get even cheaper when there is more competition.

[Ecky]

Originally Posted by nimblemotors

Not really the case here. Bluebook prices are not right.
Even the ones with bad batteries still fetch over $1,000.
How many old cars with blown engines fetch over $1,000?
There are now aftermarket prius batteries at much less cost, Dorman brand $1400, and expect that to get even cheaper when there is more competition.

And in the case of Honda's IMA, the car runs without the hybrid battery.

[user removed]

Try 3 million miles if you want to cherry pick examples.

Highest vehicle mileage | Guinness World Records

regards
mech

[user removed]

World vehicle population? Say 6-700 million versus the 1 gen Insight at 17,000. Rather a ludicrous comparison.

regards
mech

[Ecky]

The Civic Hybrid uses the same system, as does the 2nd gen Insight and CR-Z.

[IamIan]

Originally Posted by Old Mechanic

I think you can see from the used prices the hurdles faced by 10+ year old hybrid purchasers. Once the 8-10 year battery warranty expires, the used car value drops to or below that of a non hybrid but otherwise similar vehicle. Add another 10 years and they will all be gone, with few exceptions.

Already 15 year old 2000 model year here .. and all is good

I'm expecting several more decades still to get out of it.

Soo ... I'll be one of those exceptions

- - - - - -

If the HEV out of battery warranty drops to the price of a regular ICE-Only .. that's great news for the actual value of the HEV to the owner .. and bad news for the ICE-Only alternative ... because it just means that all the HEV benefits can than be had for an even smaller margin / investment .. maybe even no margin at all... Like the guy I know at work who found an I1 for $2,500 with no issues... he gets the higher MPG .. with a lower initial investment cost.

[IamIan]

Originally Posted by Old Mechanic

Try 3 million miles if you want to cherry pick examples.

Highest vehicle mileage | Guinness World Records

regards
mech

Great accomplishment .. an average of over 62,000 miles per year for 49 years ... is definitely several sigmas away from the mean.

[jamesqf]

Originally Posted by Old Mechanic

I think you can see from the used prices the hurdles faced by 10+ year old hybrid purchasers. Once the 8-10 year battery warranty expires, the used car value drops to or below that of a non hybrid but otherwise similar vehicle.

The question, though, is whether this reflects true value (= realistic battery replacement cost), or whether it is just another example of ignorance creating fear & hysteria among the hard-of-thinking. Which creates bargains for us sensible people, especially those of us who can work on our cars ourselves :-)

Add another 10 years and they will all be gone, with few exceptions.

My 2000 Insight is still going strong, though I may have to do some work on the transmission soon.