Fuel Mileage mods simplicity

[serialk11r]

Originally Posted by Mustang Dave

I added a bottle of Chevron "Techron Concentrate Fuel System Cleaner" to my Mustang's tank a few fuel-ups ago. (and counted it as fuel) No noticeable difference in MPG, but at over $85 per gallon ($7.99/12 oz. bottle), I won't make a habit of using it when nothing's wrong.

Supposedly Marvel Mystery Oil is a good fuel system cleaner, and it's pretty cheap at 5 dollars for 32 ounces.

[wmjinman]

Should we have an official "A-B-A" test on this crap to see if this guy's telling the truth? I'm retired, with a lot of time on my hands, and haven't run any kind of "fuel treatment" through my car in at least a couple of years. We've got hundreds of miles of freeway here in Nevada, so I could whip out a 4000 mile test without much trouble.

It would be fairly easy to pick a certain gas station & pump (which I do anyway), and do about a 400 mile +/- round trip out I-80 east & back, one per day. I could change the oil (it needs it), and do 2 or 3 of these "trips" as tha "A" base. Then put the crap in and do 10 more until the 4000 miles is up & see if there's any change. Maybe change the oil again & do another "baseline" & if it looks like there's anything there, put another bottle of the crap in & see what happens.

Say the word & I'll do it. Like I say, I love doing this sh**t.
Bill

[Ecky]

Originally Posted by wmjinman

Say the word & I'll do it. Like I say, I love doing this sh**t.
Bill

Please do! I've never kept close enough track of where I fill up to really quantify any differences, but I've never noticed any significant difference in what kind of fuel I put in, or what additives.

I tried a cap-full of acetone for a few tanks and saw approximately no change, have put in a few of those gas-station fuel system cleaners now and then, and Seafoam'd it once as well.

My car runs as well on Shell 93 as it does on Pa's Discount 87 octane, gets 29mpg if I drive like an a**hole and 32mpg if driven like a granny.

[wmjinman]

OK, just wrote down the name of the stuff: "Amsoil P.I. fuel system treatment". Now to find some. Seems like Amsoil isn't too rare, is it? Dunno about Wal-Mart, but can I find it at places like Autozone/O'Reilly/CarQuest?

Sea Foam is what I used a couple years ago the last (and only) time I did it before.

Oh, and as far as the "good fuel" vs. "cheap fuel" claims? I bought an '85 Jimmy (2.8 liter V-6, 5-speed manual, 4 wheel drive) new from the dealer (actually ordered it through the dealer & waited), and then proceeded to put ONLY the cheapest fuel in it I could find - ALWAYS. Drove it almosr every day from 1985 to around 2002 or 2003 (when I replaced it with my 2000 Jimmy & gave it to my parents), and never had any major engine work at all. 3 new fuel pumps, 2 new ignition "modules", a couple "tune-ups" (plugs, wires, etc), radiator hoses, fan belts, batteries, etc. I gave it to my parents when I stopped driving it, and IT STILL RUNS FINE. The odometer broke at about 3 years old and 65,969.5 miles (that number's etched into my memory, because even after numerous attempts to fix it at both two different dealers & a speedo shop in Reno, it never moved again), so I don't know how many actual miles it has on it, but it's gotta be over 200,000. A friend once said you can tell by how many sets of tires you put on it if you get like 35,000 to 40,000 miles per set. I think it's had 5 or 6 sets. Oh, although the main odometer stopped working, the TRIP odometer and speedo kept going, so that's how I was able to continue checking my mileage.

And during the time I owned it, it always turned in a solid 25 MPG on the highway with some city mixed-in. So it will take a lot to convince me that "cheap gas" will "ruin" my engine & gas mileage. (like some of my know-it-all "friends" used to try to "warn" me).

[mcrews]

wmjinman,
THere are some GREAT roads out there. I was in Sacto for 15 yrs and would drive up to modoc county (Cedarville CA) about 2 times a yr. also went ot Salt Lake city a couple of times..
YOu will certainly have consistant outside temps over any couple of weeks. My concern would be winds. But since your retired, you can pick your days.
If it was me.....I'd run 50 miles up and back 4 or 5 times. my thinking being to even out any anomolies like elavations etc.

maybe metro will chime in hear.

[wmjinman]

Good thoughts, mcrews.

You are right about the winds, when they blow, they're usually out of the west or SW, so if I go out I-80, it would be returning against a headwind - IF the wind comes up. That's what would blow the test ..... some days I could go out & come back with no wind. Other days I might go out & then the wind comes up sometime before I get back. Of course, if it's blowing steady the whole time, the out & back would cancel each other out. But then, we seldom get "steady" winds - they're usually in the form of gusts.

The other thing I was thinking, AFTER shooting off my big mouth, was that I'd probably want to do it at 40, my best MPG speed, but that would be a 10 hour day for one "out & back". Hmmmm..... can we say "tedious"? LOL ! Of course, 40 would also probably get the attention of the Highway Patrol before long on a freeway with 75 MPH speed limits. I could head out US 50, but since it isn't 4-lane, would probably end up bothering MORE people. Guess I could "bite the bullet" and do it at - say - 55 on the freeway. So much for setting any new MPG records in the process, though. hmmmm....

And once I start, I've gotta do the whole thing the same, too. hmmmm.....

[Mustang Dave]

Originally Posted by serialk11r

Supposedly Marvel Mystery Oil is a good fuel system cleaner, and it's pretty cheap at 5 dollars for 32 ounces.

That's $20/gallon - over 5 times what I'm paying for gasoline. I'll pass; unless I REALLY need to clean my fuel system.

[wmjinman]

Well, I just read through this again, and I now think to make the test as fair as possible, I'll "SeaFoam" my engine shortly before I start the test. Otherwise, this miracle product may enjoy an unfair advantage from cleaning a somewhat dirty engine. Mr. Salesman shouldn't mind, because he said there was no way of cleaning it that good short of taking it completely apart. Therefore the SeaFoam treatment would undoubtedly be insignificant.

Stopped by a couple places in town, and it's starting to appear you can't buy this AmsOil stuff off the shelf. Makes sense - make it available only through a salesman so he can give you the "line" and maybe convince you to buy some more of his stuff while he's at it. I'll keep looking for a source and in the meantime, do the SeaFoam treatment & oil change to get the engine up to "reasonable cleanliness standards" before testing the "miracle chemical".

Oh, I know - I'll do an "A-B-A" test before & after the SeaFoam too & see if THAT makes any difference. OK, getting excited now!!!

[radioranger]

Amy threads up here on water injection? My little Ranger gets a bit more power on rainy days and fog smooths it right out,

[rattroddrebel]

It would seem that i need to explain what fuel additives do. There is no "magic chemical". Fuel additives are not designed to improve fuel quality. They are designed to remove the residue left from ethanol based fuels, and lower grades of fuels. If you vehicle has been driven for 10,000 miles and you do not understand the design of the vehicle that you are driving, you just get in and go, and unless it stops running well you basically do nothing. You change your oil with whatever at Wal mart or what "daddy" always used, not knowing what an engine looks like after 100,000 miles with conventional oil inside? Times have definitely changed, oil has changed. If you drive a car that dates before 1995 today's oil will not work because it does not have Zinc Phosphate. This chemical was known to destroy catalytic converters. The problem with additives the ones that works that if they remove the debris leftover in the combustion chamber, it collects in the catalytic converter and causes it to overheat and melts it shut. I have changed out 100's due to poor knowledge. To design a hydrocarbon based fuel additive is complicated, and if you have to buy one every tank of gas, you are not saving money. My claim of the Amsoil product comes with 10 pages and pictures of the explanation of data to go with it, when i said "the only way I could do what this does is take the engine apart" is because the test data and pictures are fact, this is how i worded it because this company allows me to do that. Yes I am a salesman but I am also a mechanic that does in my business what I can to share information with all of my customers. I don't have a boat, I don't own my house, and I have no "toys". I do what I can to save my customers money. if this product does what it claims, then I must be able to back that claim up.

Fuel additives like "sea-foam" do not publish their ingredients. I will shop around to see if I can find an MSDS on that product. I do know that if you put that "junk" in your vehicle and it is not a 1978 Chevy, well I personally have dumped over 50 gas tanks with that stuff in it because it broke loose so much crap it filled the exhaust with an oil that saturated the catalytic converter so bad all it did was smoke. It is too much for today's vehicles. It has the consistency of diesel.

Amsoil is not on the shelves to control costs. Wanna know how things get on the shelf at Walmart?
1) Ingredient supplier
2) Manufacturer
3) Wholesaler
4) Distributor
5) Vendor
6) Retail

These are not in order but you get the point. There are so many middle men in retail the costs cannot be controlled, just like the gasoline and oil you are buying, too many hands in the pot.
Amsoil you can either buy online, a retail outlet, or a dealer, or you can become a preferred member and but it at dealer cost. Not to mention this company has the ONLY oil that has a 25,000 mile oil change interval. No other oil can do that, would that save you money on oil changes? It also cleans the sludge out of the block, what conventional has left behind.

Sorry guys I am ranting, if anyone would like product information I can provide it. But before you "hate" on salesman, just know that I have documented proof, or you can go online and check out the product for yourselves, there is no "selling".
As long as am a member of this site i will provide any and all information about vehicles that you would like, if you don't that's fine too. I have plenty of information I can share, this is supposed to be fun and we are supposed to help each other. Some members are not clear on that.

Hey wmjinman, I need to know what kind of vehicle you have, how many miles per month you track, a list of all of your mods, area, and average nominal atmospheric temperature of your location, products you have used, type of oil you have used, engine size, tire size, and where you get your information. I may possibly have a great deal of information for you to use, hell maybe I could increase your mpg's by 25% just by offering simple suggestions that you may not have thought of,interested? Keep in mind that I do this for a living and have access to all publications, TSB's on every vehicle, and my customer base is 30,000 people deep because of my knowledge base. I would love the opportunity to explain all aspects of automotive engineering, industrial engineering, industrial electricity and electronics, and simply "what works and what doesn't". Every product on the market has been tested in my shop. I also homebrew fuel additives that are substantially less expensive to make if you are also interested.