Hydrogen Generator Experiment

[johnmyster]

I thought we were talking about HHO? Now we're talking about Acetone instead?

Those lab tests prove that Hydrogen uptake can be used to change the stoichiometry of combustion. They do so with significant quantities of hydrogen. But wait, then you acknowledge that the testing and use of Hydrogen and HHO have nothing in common, and that these reports that support your fish oil scams have nothing to do with the subject. Which is it? Do you actually have a story?

Brief implosions that preceed the explosion? Are you kidding me? Implosions? Implosions? This is the best story that the HHO advertising camp can come up with? Implosions? I suppose there's a black hole at the center of the brown's gas molecule that quantizes the space time continuum, spitting out extra energy and thus requiring you to adjust your ignition timing.

How much gas are you able to create with a bubbler? What kind of stoichiometry does that lead to? How much of the gas is actually hydrogen and not water vapor? Not much my friend. Not much. Read these lab tests that supposedly support your claims and see the quantities that they were using. And of course. Of course they could run leaner. They were adding additional fuel. Add hydrogen, remove gasoline. Perfect. We've once again forsaken the "quality of combustion" and the "timing of combustion" arguements and gone straight back to the perpetual motion "creating hydrogen as fuel" supposition. Which is it? Is it that you're creating your own fuel? Is it that the quality of combustion is improved, or is it that you've altered combustion speed? Pick one and stick with it. You can't keep switching back and forth.

And what do manifold temperatures have to do with anything? My engine combusts in the cylinder, NOT in the manifolds. And if I'm not mistaken, my motor is a heat engine. It runs on heat. The heat from combustion causes the expansion of gasses and drives the piston. Why would I want to lower this anyway?

How many of these people that are using HHO systems are going the extra step to actually lean up their mixtures? Very few. They see some bubles, run it through a hose, and BAM, extra mileage because they drive more gingerly. How many of them go as far as to test their leaning mods with their water vapor generators turned off? None. Yup, if I reprogrammed my ECU tables to work with less fuel, I'll bet I could get a bit of extra mileage out of the thing.

Bottom line is there is a guy on the S10 forum with a stack of HHO generators in his bed, and a setup to modify his O2 readings and run lean. Still, I get better mileage in a heavier truck with lower gearing. All that PVC and plastic hose in his bed doesn't seem to get him very far, but he's convinced it does, just as you are. I don't need to try it out. I'm trying out mods that do work.

People have been touting that you could run your car on water since the 1970's and the story is still the same. It still hasn't gained acceptance. Only now, with the ease of propogating false information and false "research" on the internet can everybody with a google toolbar convince themselves of the automotive and petroleum conspiracy to squash this "innovative new technology."

[ConnClark]

johnmyster its good to see someone else with their head on straight.

Just remember that if you thrash the shyster's arguments too harshly they will whine and the thread will get locked. ( I was hoping to do that on monday )

[johnmyster]

And when it does, there'll be another thread talking about some other made up reason that it works.

Well, before it gets locked...

Enough already with water-4-gas, hydro-assist and PICC... - Topic Powered by eve community

Schadewald, Robert J. (2008), Worlds of Their Own - A Brief History of Misguided Ideas: Creationism, Flat-Earthism, Energy Scams, and the Velikovsky Affair, Xlibris, ISBN 978-1-4636-0435-1

[carfreak]

Originally Posted by cfg83

88CRX -



110% agreement here. For HHO to work, the car must be reconfigured for lean burn. That's one of the reasons it's a PITA to make work. A diesel engine likes to "go-lean" by design, so it is a better ICE for the job.

I have an HHO generator from Hydrogen Boost Brown’s Gas Joe Cell HHO Water Car Save fuel mpg</. just like Daox says, I haven't had any results. However, I have not been willing to implement all the mods required for "the system" to work. This includes MAP and 02 sensor spoofs, and a fuel heater (using waste heat from engine coolant).

If I had to do it all over again, I would seriously *consider* this gizmo :

HydranOx - $400
Hydrogen Fuel System Portal Page :: Sigma Automotive

The reason I am curious about it is that it *claims* to separate the H2 from the 02. If the gizmo is only sending H2 into the air intake, this would remove the need to modify the 02 sensor, which I like, . But, I wouldn't pump the 02 into the cabin of the car, that's for sure.

I am not saying that the above gizmo is not a scam, I am just saying that it claims to solve an existing deficiency with HHO designs.

CarloSW2

Well, the bad part is that it only generates 2 liters per hour. And that was measuring the hydrogen and the oxygen. Were not replacing the fuel with hydrogen, but that's not enought to do anything as far as I am concerned. The unit I have is from Main Hydrogen Page and gets 65 LPH which is much higher and pretty low amps considering the difference (17 amps) Hope that helps ya some.

[ConnClark]

maybe you should read this post in this thread

http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthrea...html#post43549

The only way these things save any fuel is by making your wallet lighter.

[carfreak]

Originally Posted by ConnClark

maybe you should read this post in this thread

http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthrea...html#post43549

The only way these things save any fuel is by making your wallet lighter.

appreciate the thread, but everything that was said has nothing to do with the way it works. Were not replacing the fuel with hydrogen (never will happen this way)...it's just burning more efficiently. Instead of losing 15-20% out your tail pipe, you lose about 5-7%...I can talk for an hour about the other benefits, but probably a waste of time since most people have their minds closed off to the notion that it's already working.

[ConnClark]

Originally Posted by carfreak

it's just burning more efficiently. Instead of losing 15-20% out your tail pipe, you lose about 5-7%.

Unless hydrogen magically converts the Otto cycle to a Carnot or ideal Diesel cycle that is not possible.

Perhaps you could enlighten everyone how it does just this small portion of its magic.

[Blister]

Originally Posted by Formula413

........... because, in theory, it would supply a perfect 2/1 mix of hydrogen and oxygen into the intake stream, which would enter the exhaust stream as water vapor which would be ignored by the O2s.

This isn't exactly true. The only water vapor that would enter the the exhaust stream would be from inefficient hydrogen burn. Burnt hydrogen is helium and is not a component in water so an inefficient burn will be the only cause of water coming out of the exhaust. The unspent (inefficiently burnt) hydrogen will automatically recombine with any surrounding oxygen making the water vapor.

That's the basis of the hydrogen fuel cell. Reverse electrolysis (recombination of hydrogen and oxygen) creates a charge naturally and is used to power an electric motor, the only emission is water. So, insufficient combustion of hydrogen within the cylinder is the only reason that water would come out of the exhaust ports in an HHO system.

This is mainly what turned me away from digging further into hydrogen/hydroxy systems. Permanent magnet alternators can be introduced into the engine bay, running off of the same belts without regulators for higher production but the bottom line is that I would be using up the basic components of water while the planet currently seems to be having issues surrounding water. Anyway, I'm not what one would consider "green" but I do like efficiency. The more efficient these systems become and the burn becomes, it's stands to reason that the more water problems we will have.

It is amazing to me that sites like treehugger and other green sites endorse HHO for internal combustion. On a side note, I'm all for the home enthusiast building a system like this and building it well but mass production and legislation requiring this scares me a bit.

[Formula413]

Originally Posted by Blister

This isn't exactly true. The only water vapor that would enter the the exhaust stream would be from inefficient hydrogen burn. Burnt hydrogen is helium and is not a component in water so an inefficient burn will be the only cause of water coming out of the exhaust. The unspent (inefficiently burnt) hydrogen will automatically recombine with any surrounding oxygen making the water vapor.

So when hydrogen is burned it doesn't combine with oxygen to form H2O? I thought that was how it worked.

[ConnClark]

Originally Posted by Blister

This isn't exactly true. The only water vapor that would enter the the exhaust stream would be from inefficient hydrogen burn. Burnt hydrogen is helium and is not a component in water so an inefficient burn will be the only cause of water coming out of the exhaust.

This couldn't be further from the truth.

Combining two hydrogen nuclei to form helium is called nuclear fusion.

Fusion power - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

hydrogen combustion always results in the production of water.