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Old 12-07-2012, 07:51 AM   #231 (permalink)
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I think the CFLs will be replaced with LEDs.

I too can remember when the air quality here was many times worse than it is now, but it seems like those who are devout advocates of their position on global warming are very good at "doom and gloom". Now lets see if they have any solutions.

The USA was a pioneer in manufacturing when the effects of various emissions were practically unknown and there is a price involved with being the "pioneer", both good and bad.

Other countries also have the advantage, if you want to call it that, of coming to the show later in time. Lets hope they can learn from our experience and get to a level of prosperity without such a high cost.

That is where you could make a difference, but to expect them to tolerate draconian rules and regulations in the pursuit for clean air and relatively stable global temperatures, when we the USA, set such a poor example is rather arrogant from their perspective.

Cooperation and compromise don't mix well with arrogance and an inflated sense of self worth, a problem which seems to plague a small minority of members here.

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Old 12-07-2012, 09:24 AM   #232 (permalink)
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Did you know that fluorescent tubes that we have had for like 60 years have far more mercury in them than is used in CFL's? It is like 40mg vs 2-3mg. We already have recycling for CFL's and the tube fluorescent - my local Aubuchon Hardware takes them, and I think other stores do as well. They recover the mercury and use it in new CFL bulbs.

You know where a HUGE majority of the mercury that is poisoning our world comes from? Burning coal. I'm glad you're concerned about mercury, and we need to stop burning coal asap. By the way, with the amount of electricity saved by using CFL's instead of incandescent bulb, you probably save more mercury from getting into the environment - than if you throw away the CFL's. But of course, you can recycle them.

And yes, I'm transitioning over to LED's as the CFL's stop working. And I'm using some of the old incandescent bulb in the winter when the 98% waste heat is helpful, anyway. But come summer, I'll put LED's - and stay cooler. If I used A/C it would be maddening to have ~98% of the electricity used by bulbs then have to be pumped out of the house by the A/C.
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Old 12-07-2012, 11:16 AM   #233 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilBlanchard View Post
Did you know that fluorescent tubes that we have had for like 60 years have far more mercury in them than is used in CFL's? It is like 40mg vs 2-3mg. We already have recycling for CFL's and the tube fluorescent - my local Aubuchon Hardware takes them, and I think other stores do as well. They recover the mercury and use it in new CFL bulbs.

You know where a HUGE majority of the mercury that is poisoning our world comes from? Burning coal. I'm glad you're concerned about mercury, and we need to stop burning coal asap. By the way, with the amount of electricity saved by using CFL's instead of incandescent bulb, you probably save more mercury from getting into the environment - than if you throw away the CFL's. But of course, you can recycle them.

And yes, I'm transitioning over to LED's as the CFL's stop working. And I'm using some of the old incandescent bulb in the winter when the 98% waste heat is helpful, anyway. But come summer, I'll put LED's - and stay cooler. If I used A/C it would be maddening to have ~98% of the electricity used by bulbs then have to be pumped out of the house by the A/C.
100% correct here. Coal power can be clean, as the coal industry claims with its "clean coal" campaign, but it really isn't because the majority of coal power plants havent been fitted with all of the emmissions equipment.

The reason for this is that power companies are regulated over all power generated per KWH. If their total emissions are lower than a certain level they don't have to do anything to say an old plant.

As far as LED's I have to actually build my own bulbs because it seems no one converts to even relatively clean DC before the bulbs and the flicker plays havoc with my migranes.
 
Old 12-07-2012, 01:54 PM   #234 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheEnemy View Post
Coal power can be clean, as the coal industry claims with its "clean coal" campaign...
No, there is no possible way coal can be clean. You burn coal, you create CO2. Inescapable fact of chemistry.

If you don't like CFLs or LEDs, wait a year or two for this Goodbye, fluorescent light bulbs: New lighting technology won't flicker, shatter or burn out
 
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Old 12-07-2012, 01:59 PM   #235 (permalink)
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Yep, airconditioning incandescent lamps is simply throwing cold money at hot objects.
 
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Old 12-07-2012, 04:20 PM   #236 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Mechanic
I too can remember when the air quality here was many times worse than it is now...
Around 1970 I was driving East on the freeway around dusk. Since I was in a 1957 Beetle, I had a round driver's door mirror and I could see the setting sun perfectly centered in the round mirror. In the surrounding twilight, I had a moment and went "Awww...." until I realized the sun wasn't setting behind the hills; it was setting into the air pollution.

Quote:
Cooperation and compromise don't mix well with arrogance and an inflated sense of self worth, a problem which seems to plague a small minority of members here.
Words I've learned recently include:
Agorism
Social Anarchism

jamesqf --I thought I was going to have to go looking for that link. Thanks for posting it.

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Old 12-07-2012, 06:17 PM   #237 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jamesqf View Post
No, there is no possible way coal can be clean. You burn coal, you create CO2. Inescapable fact of chemistry.

If you don't like CFLs or LEDs, wait a year or two for this Goodbye, fluorescent light bulbs: New lighting technology won't flicker, shatter or burn out
I expect they would still flicker with AC power like LEDs, but we will see.

I have been using CFL's for over 15 years, and dispite a general lack of recycling in my community I do get them recycled.
 
Old 12-07-2012, 10:31 PM   #238 (permalink)
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All cfls and flourescents should be recycled of course but I've never , ever , met anyone who did, they should have like a 5 $ deposit so they get saved,
 
Old 12-07-2012, 10:33 PM   #239 (permalink)
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I'm also willing to bet a lot of recycling involves throwing them out later on, it can't be cheap to get the mercury out and then what? plus leds use 1/4 the power , every one i put in my house saves me roughly 1 $ per month on my bill provided its a blulb used say 4 hours a day like the kithcen etc, paybacks around 2.5 years then all good .
 
Old 12-07-2012, 10:52 PM   #240 (permalink)
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I recycle them, and I have to think that they actually do recover the mercury. Why would Aubuchon have a policy like that and then just chuck 'em?

LED's are very similar power consumption to CFL's. I recently got some 8W bulbs that are nice and bright (and they are dimmable), but up until now, CFL's have had more lumens/watt than LED's. I like LED's coming on full brightness right away.

Enemy, have you tried dimmable LED's?

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