Which is more evil, meat, soy, gluten, or southpaws?

[jamesqf]

Originally Posted by Fat Charlie

He let me go with a warning for 72 in a 40 (another half mile and it would have been a 35) because he gave all the local kids one freebie.

Local kids from prosperous families, no?

Five years later the FBI was investigating the town because his program for the town to stop cars that didn't seem to have any business in town just coincidentally stopped mainly people with dark skin passing through on the state highway.

But is the important factor here dark skin, or passing through? Presumably without money enough to fight a ticket, so easy revenue for the town.

Society placed me on cruise control for a good life. I've got problems and struggles, but I own a house and have money in the bank.

I think you've put your finger on the important factor: money. Grow up as a poor white kid, and your experience is likely to be a heck of a lot closer to what Black Lives Matter claims as racism, than what you experience. Take your experience with the cop. Where I grew up (small enough that everyone basically knew who everyone else was), if you were from one of the more prosperous families, the cops wouldn't even have stopped you. If you were poor, you might find yourself hauled off to the police station (~20 miles away), perhaps thumped a few times with a nightstick on the way.

[Fat Charlie]

No, we were nowhere near the upper end of the town by far. My car (my parents' backup) was at the time 12 years old and was tied for worst in the high school parking lot. It was just how he made into to speeding tickets easier on the town's kids.

[Natalya]

Outcomes matter. BLM has numbers that indicate blacks are more likely per capita to be stopped, arrested, convicted, given harsher sentences, or killed than their white peers. Income, age, etc controlled for the chances are higher of more negative//severe consequences for blacks at all levels of interaction with law enforcement, irrespective of whether the cop was white, black, or anything else. Personal prejudice isn't the only kind of racism, it can occur across an institution.

[Xist]

People really do not like math, so this will undoubtedly be unpopular:
Five hundred black murder victims in 2015 were killed by whites--8.6%. Two hundred and twenty nine white murder victims in 2015 were killed by blacks the same year--15.8%. "People tend to kill who they know." Blacks killed 2,340 blacks and whites killed 2,574 whites in 2015. https://www.usnews.com/news/articles...by-the-numbers

[Fat Charlie]

I've got a lot of numbers going around at work today, so I'm probably confused on my end and I'll just cut and paste a bit.

Blacks killed 2,340 blacks
whites killed 2,574 whites

Five hundred black murder victims in 2015 were killed by whites--8.6%
Two hundred and twenty nine white murder victims in 2015 were killed by blacks--15.8%

There are more white murder victims overall, but 229 white deaths count as 15.8% while over twice as many black deaths are counted as about half the percentage? It seems that black lives, in fact, don't matter as much as white lives.

My math shows 500 out of 2840 black victims to be 17.6% and 229 out of 2803 to be 8.2%- so white murder victims are less than half as likely to have been killed by blacks than black murder victims are to have been killed by whites. I didn't research any of this, I just saw your numbers and the math didn't look right. Maybe you just transposed the numbers?

[cRiPpLe_rOoStEr]

Originally Posted by Ecky

Even if you account for women on average knowing less about cars, there's still a difference in what they get at a dealership.

Most of the women in my family don't really care about cars and tend to use them mostly as another appliance. When my mom had a flexfuel Chevrolet Celta, which actually had a better fuel-efficiency when a higher amount of ethanol was added to the gasoline (IIRC the legal ethanol content in Brazilian gasoline at the time was still 25%), she didn't even bother about it, even though she complained about its performance with E25. Last year I went with her to the Toyota dealer in the city where she lives (now she has a Toyota Etios) in order to get an estimate for some bodywork and replacement of the right taillight, and I noticed the clerk seemed quite bothered to see me there.

[redpoint5]

Regarding the color of people arrested in the US; there is a correlation between doing crime, and being arrested. By my estimate, perhaps 2% of incarcerated people are innocent. Mostly our jails are populated with criminals, not people caught wearing the wrong skin.

Originally Posted by Xist

People tend to kill who they know." Blacks killed 2,340 blacks and whites killed 2,574 whites in 2015.

I don't really see the relevancy of keeping track of the self-identified skin color of the person doing the murdering. It's wrong regardless of the color. The family and community that raises murderers is responsible to instill pro-social behavior, regardless of color.

Originally Posted by cRiPpLe_rOoStEr

Last year I went with her to the Toyota dealer in the city where she lives (now she has a Toyota Etios) in order to get an estimate for some bodywork and replacement of the right taillight, and I noticed the clerk seemed quite bothered to see me there.

I dated a girl who had purchased a brand new Chevy Aveo; the worst car in America. After 2 years of ownership, she let a dealer talk her into buying a brand new Aveo in a color she liked better and taking her "old" car as a trade-in. This, after consulting with me first. That's when I knew the relationship wasn't going to last.

[Ecky]

Originally Posted by redpoint5

I don't really see the relevancy of keeping track of the self-identified skin color of the person doing the murdering. It's wrong regardless of the color. The family and community that raises murderers is responsible to instill pro-social behavior, regardless of color.

Agreed.

There's a proportionately larger portion of minorities committing crimes, regardless of whether they're discriminated against by law enforcement. Criminal activity has a very strong correlation with poverty across all groups. There is a similarly disproportionate amount of poverty among minorities - even those whose families have been in the US for generations. Why are minorities so disproportionately poor?

I'm sure the answer is not one-dimensional, but this is definitely worth considering.

[redpoint5]

Originally Posted by Ecky

There's a proportionately larger portion of minorities committing crimes, regardless of whether they're discriminated against by law enforcement. Criminal activity has a very strong correlation with poverty across all groups. There is a similarly disproportionate amount of poverty among minorities - even those whose families have been in the US for generations. Why are minorities so disproportionately poor?

I'm sure the answer is not one-dimensional, but this is definitely worth considering.

Minority status and poverty are not well correlated. Neither is minority status and crime. Japanese Americans are a miniscule population in the US, yet their rates of poverty and crime are lower than other minority groups. This, despite the "racist" act of arresting (internment) all "Japs" as recently as 1946.

Speaking in terms of minority status isn't very useful because it doesn't describe the actual differences in values/behavior between the minority group and the majority group. Furthermore, everyone is a member of some minority group. I've never tried illicit drugs, perhaps that is a minority group. I'm 1/4 Japanese, so that has to be a minority group. I grew up on a sheep farm, for sure that is a minority group.

What is useful is to observe behavioral differences and make correlations.

• 63% of youth suicides are from fatherless homes (US Dept. Of Health/Census) – 5 times the average.
• 90% of all homeless and runaway children are from fatherless homes – 32 times the average.
• 85% of all children who show behavior disorders come from fatherless homes – 20 times the average. (Center for Disease Control)
• 80% of rapists with anger problems come from fatherless homes –14 times the average. (Justice & Behavior, Vol 14, p. 403-26)
• 71% of all high school dropouts come from fatherless homes – 9 times the average. (National Principals Association Report)

This is just a short list of negative outcomes for children from single-parent homes. When you look at outcomes for adults from single-parent homes, you see a rise in crime, poverty, and becoming a single-parent themselves.

It appears crime and poverty are correlated with family structure. If crime is caused by poverty (which is a dubious assumption), then by extension crime is caused by sub-optimal family structure.

The minority groups that have higher rates of 2-parent households have a corresponding better rate of outcomes.





Perhaps the fatalist political propaganda that "poor" is the root of all problems and that it is inescapable without a band of involuntary saints (taxpayers) subsidizing their "progress" is terribly harmful.

I'm sure that those who believe poor is the root of all evil are well-intentioned, but most every example of trying to remedy the problem of poverty by throwing money at it has been a failure. This is because poverty is not the root problem, but merely another symptom of a complex problem.

[jamesqf]

Originally Posted by Natalya

BLM has numbers that indicate...

Well, naturally they have those numbers, because those are the numbers that support the claims they're trying to make. other people might have different numbers. "Lies, damned lies, and statistics", IOW.

The real problem, though, is that they're still stuck on classifying things by racial groups, which is really nothing more than perpetuating racism. If you look instead at the way cops tend to treat individuals down on the lower rungs of the economic/social ladder, you see a very different picture than the sort of "racist cops" theory they're pushing. And which IMHO looses them a lot of supporters from all the non-black people who've experienced the same sort of mistreatment.