Go Back   EcoModder Forum > EcoModding > Fossil Fuel Free > Open ReVolt: open source DC motor controller
Register Now
 Register Now
 

Reply  Post New Thread
 
Submit Tools LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 05-22-2013, 01:44 PM   #6111 (permalink)
PaulH
 
MPaulHolmes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Maricopa, AZ (sort of. Actually outside of town)
Posts: 3,826

Michael's Electric Beetle - '71 Volkswagen Superbeetle 500000
Thanks: 1,365
Thanked 1,113 Times in 730 Posts
That is very cool. I don't have to tell you that you NEED to make a video!!! I want to see that monstrosity of awesomeness. No pressure though. Take your time.

I recently bought seven 600v 600amp IGBTs. One of them is for a maximum power point tracking charger (fancy way of saying it makes the output current as big as possible. lol) for my solar array. Then I need to figure out what to do with the other 6. Hmm... 6*600 = 3600 amps... Maybe derate to 2000. I've got that golf cart outside. I think the motor can probably do a tenth of that for like 3 seconds. haha. There's always Ben, ready to test anything. I bet his motor wouldn't break. It's 10" diameter I think.

I also got some 10mil x 12" x 4 foot copper sheet, and some 5 mil x 1.5" x 36 yard Kapton tape, which is good to like 18,000 volts of insulation.

I also ordered 2 ring capacitors, but they are smaller 500uF types. One of them is for the solar charger, and one is for probably the 3 phase inverter.

The buck charger should be good to around 70kW how it is, since I'm using a 200amp continuous inductor inside it. It's so nice to have 5600W worth of power at basically any stinking voltage I want! Thank you panels! Well, in increments of 35-45v. From 35v at 155 amps up to 700v at 8 amps. But they will only be good for another 40-50 years, so I better hurry. hahaha.

Oh crap! here's some competition:
MPPT charger

Theirs can output all the way up to 48v! holy cow! hahaha. And an input of all the way to 200v. The ONLY MPPT charger that works with the new high voltage panels. what the heck?! 200v is some kind of record? Have they never heard of 600v 600amp IGBTs on ebay?

__________________
kits and boards

Last edited by MPaulHolmes; 05-22-2013 at 03:08 PM..
  Reply With Quote
Alt Today
Popular topics

Other popular topics in this forum...

   
Old 05-22-2013, 03:11 PM   #6112 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Charlton MA, USA
Posts: 463

EVVette - '71 Chevy Corvette Coupe
Thanks: 31
Thanked 172 Times in 92 Posts
A relative of my cousin works for apollo solar. There stuff is mainly designed for bringing power to 3rd world country's. Its pretty nice stuff.

-Adam
__________________
www.EVVette.com - 1971 Corvette Coupe Conversion to all Electric!
www.AdamBrunette.com - Machining, CNC, Robotics and Electronics.

You can download RTD Explorer for the Cougar controllers at www.EVVette.com
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-22-2013, 03:53 PM   #6113 (permalink)
PaulH
 
MPaulHolmes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Maricopa, AZ (sort of. Actually outside of town)
Posts: 3,826

Michael's Electric Beetle - '71 Volkswagen Superbeetle 500000
Thanks: 1,365
Thanked 1,113 Times in 730 Posts
I guess they wouldn't need 300v and 70000w in most places. Batteries are really really really expensive in Kenya at least. In Kisumu, a 12v solar battery was like $400 and wasn't even that high of amp hours. And their panels were like $5/watt. Sort of cost prohibitive when you make < $1 a day. The highest voltage "array" I ever saw was 12v. Some guy was charging like $0.10 to charge people's cell phones. (yes, everyone has a cell phone!)
__________________
kits and boards
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-22-2013, 04:40 PM   #6114 (permalink)
EV test pilot
 
bennelson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Oconomowoc, WI, USA
Posts: 4,434

Electric Cycle - '81 Kawasaki KZ440
90 day: 334.6 mpg (US)

S10 - '95 Chevy S10
90 day: 30.48 mpg (US)

Electro-Metro - '96 Ben Nelson's "Electro-Metro"
90 day: 129.81 mpg (US)

The Wife's Car - Plug-in Prius - '04 Toyota Prius
90 day: 78.16 mpg (US)
Thanks: 17
Thanked 654 Times in 383 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by MPaulHolmes View Post
There's always Ben, ready to test anything. I bet his motor wouldn't break.
I'll need a controller for my Hybrid Pickup Truck Project. 1000 amps would be good. I STILL don't have the actual motor yet, but I have a junkyard friend keeping his eyes open. I'm hoping for a 13" forklift motor.

This would be direct coupled to the rear axle (via the driveshaft) so I'll need LOTS of AMPS!
__________________


300mpg.org Learn how to BUILD YOUR OWN ELECTRIC CAR CHEAP
My YouTube Videos
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to bennelson For This Useful Post:
MPaulHolmes (05-22-2013)
Old 05-25-2013, 02:21 AM   #6115 (permalink)
EcoModding Apprentice
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: southland NZ
Posts: 153
Thanks: 38
Thanked 81 Times in 52 Posts
Hi Paul,

I have to return my borrowed controller to its owner tomorrow so..

I need to finish rebuilding my controller,
I have rebuilt the power board with a new board, new MOSFETs and diodes

You suggested that I replace the MOSFET driver IC,
I have bought a new one - but De-soldering and replacing the old one on the controller board does worry me

Should I test the assembly with the existing MOSFET driver?
Or should I go straight to de-soldering and replacing?

Any advice?? - please
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-25-2013, 09:15 AM   #6116 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: 18603, USA
Posts: 759

The Crimson Crawler - '04 Hyundai Elantra GLS
90 day: 36.71 mpg (US)
Thanks: 221
Thanked 60 Times in 45 Posts
Quick question for you all. If I end up with a couple extra holes in my bus bars, will that affect current handling really bad? I may change heat sinks which will change IGBT spacing. So, I may have 2 holes that aren't used after changing. They'll be 1/4" holes, maybe smaller.

Is that a big deal, or should I not worry about it?
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-25-2013, 01:53 PM   #6117 (permalink)
EcoModding Lurker
 
SEBART PL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Poland
Posts: 21
Thanks: 7
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
My controler second fail

Hello every one I want to publish short story of my experience with Coguar 500 AMP DC controler Rev D or C

I gave someone to build for me this controler he did good job with electronics on the Paul and Sabrina board but power board was DIY, it is own design which take less space - mosfets diodes and radiator are on top level, next level are steering board and capacitors.
anyway
I dit 75 miles and put 5th gear on low speed 25 miles
on my Alfa 145 95year
(1460 kg weigh 6Vx12=72V pack 220 Ah )... and mosfet cooked and break down, I had to turn off contactor couse mosfet sticked together and gave full power all the time.

We thought OK thats happened and we put new Mosfets as specyfied on this project. We put as well new resistors on mosfets gates and mosfets drivers and zener diode near driver. And he did not put this 3 small Polypropylene Capacitor ECW-F2225JB on power board maybe couse was not publish on schematic.

I have put more batteries 14x6V=84V and started engine few time without load. I did not conect cable for stering contactors couse I didn't had diode for contactors.
I did 1/4 mile and mosfet cooked - failed again faster than first time.

What we do wrong? I think this way:
1. Temperature is to high couse mosfets where in small chanel without air around.
Possible solutions from my point of view - I need to build new power board like it is in assembly instruction march 2011.

2. Mosfets are poor quality and one failed couse blown up all .

3. Steering board is bad design or need to be improved but many of you ride on this controler so this point is almost not possible.

For more soulutions please WRITE what you think for any reply thanks in advance.

Can I use IGBT instead of mosfets with this control board - rev.D without any amendments? Or maybe there are now better mosfets type than this 130A 200V - IRFP4668PbF ? I think to put cheaper one IRFP90N20D SMPS MOSFET MOSFET
VDSS RDS(on) max ID
200V 0.023Ω 94A - the resistance is bigger but three time cheaper.

My engine is 200 A 80 V 13,5 kW dc series the controled engine worked nice and smoth, throtle is very sensitive , I have puted John parametrs into software with 200 Amps limit but I am not sure this couse this was one year ago.

I have read last posts from 602 - 6018 and 6022 and I see Duncan got blown up mosfets like me, he want to put new mosfets with 20mohm and Power disipation 900W that is high, and the worse thing is that no one found why his mosfets blowned up - this should not happened, temperature braker circut should stop this, I do not know what to do now with this problem, maybe add water cooling one pipe driled through doubled radiator.
Sebastian
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	P1010161.jpg
Views:	90
Size:	140.9 KB
ID:	13080   Click image for larger version

Name:	P1010162.jpg
Views:	96
Size:	102.7 KB
ID:	13081   Click image for larger version

Name:	P1010163.jpg
Views:	83
Size:	101.2 KB
ID:	13082   Click image for larger version

Name:	P1010164.jpg
Views:	88
Size:	91.3 KB
ID:	13083  

Last edited by SEBART PL; 05-26-2013 at 03:33 PM..
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-2013, 03:14 PM   #6118 (permalink)
EcoModding Lurker
 
SEBART PL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Poland
Posts: 21
Thanks: 7
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by duncan View Post
Should I test the assembly with the existing MOSFET driver?
Or should I go straight to de-soldering and replacing?

Any advice?? - please
You need to change it before any tests, couse bad driver can make short circuit on your mosfets. You need to change as well new resistors on mosfets gates.

I am planning after second blown up changed:
-power board (first was custom made) I want to put double 15 microns but maybe should be double 30 microns thick - please advice
-rezystors R17, R36-45 (20 Ohm) diode D6
- mic4451 U7 i U6 HCPL-4504
for sure c21, c20, R16, C18 and Q1

but ...
Ducan have you found what caused your controler failed at first place? Have you put 170A or 130A power mosfets? I asking couse I have cooked mosfets as well and I am not sure for 100% why and what is wrong or could be wrong, please help anyone.

Last edited by SEBART PL; 05-26-2013 at 03:36 PM..
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-2013, 08:42 PM   #6119 (permalink)
EcoModding Apprentice
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: southland NZ
Posts: 153
Thanks: 38
Thanked 81 Times in 52 Posts
Hi Sebart

I am a mechanical guy - so the OpenRevolt controller is the first complex electronic device I have made

Anyway
I built the controller expecting to get it on the car in a couple of weeks -
over a year later the car was completed,
during that year my controller was in a dusty workshop used for woodwork as well as my car

When I energized it for the first time there was a pop and and some smoke -
I tested it and it still worked so the car was driven on it's test drives (I decided that I had zapped a passing spider)
A couple of weeks later
I then checked the isolation to the chassis - OOPS - took the controller off and found a blown MOSFET

I replaced two MOSFETS - everything was good - chassis was isolated, car went well

Later when I switched on the pre-charge - my pre-charge light didn't go off - stayed lit
I stupidly energized the contactor and the car lurched as it blew a number of MOSFETS and one of my battery terminals

My "diagnosis"
The first failure was caused by either dust/spiders or possibly a gate resistor not properly soldered

The second failure was caused by - damage from the first failure
or possibly what I was doing with the pre-charge

I was pre-charging with a halogen bulb - that is OK

BUT I was also discharging the capacitors every time I shut the car down by disconnecting the battery and driving the car forwards using the capacitors
The car would lurch forwards a couple of inches

Reading the thread Paul also did some damage discharging capacitors this way

Another possible reason for the failure
the original MOSFETS were IRFP4668 with a second line saying RO41P
The two replacement MOSFETS were IRFP4668 with a second line saying R137P
Don't know if that would make any difference but different batches may react differently and not share well

I have now built a new power board - all new diodes and MOSFETS - re-using the capacitors
Using the standard OpenRevolt parts

I am waiting for the new gate resistors

I do have the new MOSFET driver but I was awaiting advice as I find that I can build a circuit - but rebuilding seems to require a higher skill set

I am still looking to build a more powerful controller as I am using my car for some motorsport and more is always better - but I have decided to wait until the experts on this forum complete their development and then buy the new kit
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-2013, 09:44 PM   #6120 (permalink)
PaulH
 
MPaulHolmes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Maricopa, AZ (sort of. Actually outside of town)
Posts: 3,826

Michael's Electric Beetle - '71 Volkswagen Superbeetle 500000
Thanks: 1,365
Thanked 1,113 Times in 730 Posts
I agree with Sebart that you should change the mosfet driver.

Sebart, 5th gear at 25mph I think would have a very heavy motor current requirement. The motor would be turning so slowly. I think that would be very hard on the controller. 2nd gear at 25mph would be safer. You want the motor spinning at like 3000-4000 rpm.

IGBTs have a long turnoff, so it's better to use negative voltage for turnoff with them. I'm not sure if you can use the board unchanged with them or not. The temperature probe is on the heat spreader. There's a short time delay before the temp sensor gets the memo that the mosfets/diodes are getting really hot. There are quite a few people that have contacted me that have put thousands of miles on their controllers, but I can't really figure out what went wrong from a long distance away, when it's a different power board design. My guess is that 5th gear at low speeds was really hard on it.

Nevyn, I wouldn't worry about the holes at all.

__________________
kits and boards
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to MPaulHolmes For This Useful Post:
duncan (05-26-2013)
Reply  Post New Thread


Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Paul and Sabrina's Cheap 3 Phase Inverter (AC Controller) with Field Oriented Control MPaulHolmes Fossil Fuel Free 3457 10-03-2019 04:50 PM
Paul & Sabrina's Cheap EV Conversion MPaulHolmes Fossil Fuel Free 542 11-12-2016 09:09 PM
Three Dirt Cheap DIY Electric Cars - Part 5 SVOboy EcoModder Blog Discussion 0 12-12-2008 04:10 PM



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.5.2
All content copyright EcoModder.com