Range anxiety is overrated

[NeilBlanchard]

Ninety nine plus percent of the time, EV's get charged at home, and this saves a lot of time. Gas stations are often busy, and you wait in line, and you have to remember to go there. I park in my driveway, and plug in, if I need a charge - it takes less than a minute.

There are MILLIONS of places to charge an EV. We have a Level 2 at home, and share it between 2 EV's - soon to be 3. We have 3 drivers, and that will soon be 4.

I have only ever used a quick charger about 8 or 9 times in nearly 2 years of driving EV's. We are getting more quick chargers, and that means we can take more longer trips.

[Fat Charlie]

Originally Posted by jamesqf

...which I don't think counts generation, transmission, and, charging losses.

Pet peeve here: Everyone counts that against EVs' efficiency as if it's worse than the losses in getting fuel to our ICEs. Delivery trucks, idling at gas stations...

[oil pan 4]

Originally Posted by NeilBlanchard

Ninety nine plus percent of the time, EV's get charged at home, and this saves a lot of time. Gas stations are often busy, and you wait in line, and you have to remember to go there. I park in my driveway, and plug in, if I need a charge - it takes less than a minute.

There are MILLIONS of places to charge an EV. We have a Level 2 at home, and share it between 2 EV's - soon to be 3. We have 3 drivers, and that will soon be 4.

I have only ever used a quick charger about 8 or 9 times in nearly 2 years of driving EV's. We are getting more quick chargers, and that means we can take more longer trips.

I know that. I don't care about that.
I wanted to know how many super chargers there are since you were comparing a super charges to gas pumps.
Since the house charger doesn't do you any good when you are away from home and need power. Plus the subject of the post is "range anxiety".

[NeilBlanchard]

I am not comparing quick chargers to gas pumps.

By the way Supercharger is the brand name of Tesla chargers; not generic quick chargers.

Range anxiety means that you don't trust the range remaining gauge. The more I drive EV's the more I trust them.

Just yesterday, I was down to 2 miles remaining. I got home and plugged in. No problem and it took 30 seconds.

If you drove EV's as much as I have - you would not have any range anxiety. Do you have range anxiety when your fuel gauge gets down low?

[Fat Charlie]

Originally Posted by NeilBlanchard

If you drove EV's as much as I have - you would not have any range anxiety. Do you have range anxiety when your fuel gauge gets down low?

Every tank.

I can easily have 20 miles between gas stations, and having the time to stop for them is rare. With only a 10.6 gallon tank, lots of hills, unpredictable traffic and changing weather, I can never tell how much farther I'm going to get even with a well calibrated UltraGauge.

Sometimes I don't know why people buy these gas powered things!

[jamesqf]

Originally Posted by NeilBlanchard

All the EV's with quick chargers are evidence that is not a problem.

Nope, all those superchargers are evidence that the current crop of EVs are being sold to people who mostly don't care about charging losses or long-term battery life. Why else all the hype about wireless charging?

You are comparing the LEAST efficient EV with the MOST efficient hybrid. Do the math with 7 people in the Tesla, and 2 people in the Insight.

No, I'm comparing vehicles I could buy now, that would meet my need for a roughly 200 mile range. The ability to fit 7 people in a Tesla is not a plus to me*, because I only rarely have even one other person riding with me - and observation suggests that this is in fact the norm.

(*In fact it's a negative, since I don't want to drive something that big.)

Ninety nine plus percent of the time, EV's get charged at home...

Circular argument. EVs are charged at home because the people who have them are mostly the ones who don't need more range than they get on a single charge. Which is great for them, not so great for those who need more range.

Range anxiety means that you don't trust the range remaining gauge.

No, that's NOT what it means in the context of this discussion. It means that the EV will not have the range (with reasonable reserve) that meets a potential buyer's needs.

As for range anxiety with a gas vehicle, sure I'd have that (and have had, occasionally). But with a range of ~700 miles on a full tank, it's seldom an issue. More often it's whether I can get to the cheap gas station, or have to use one that's 30 cents/gal more.

[oil pan 4]

When it's midnight and my fuel is getting low, in the boonies where all the gas stations all have bankers hours and towing something causing mpgs to be way down yes I do get range anxiety.

[NeilBlanchard]

Originally Posted by jamesqf

Nope, all those superchargers are evidence that the current crop of EVs are being sold to people who mostly don't care about charging losses or long-term battery life. Why else all the hype about wireless charging?

Look - quick charging does not noticeably harm the battery. Tesla's Supercharger system is their own, and battery degradation is NOT an issue with their battery. The only battery degradation issue I know of, is with early Nissan Leaf (up to mid 2014) and it is not because of CHAdeMO charging - but with high air temperatures in general.

What "hype" about wireless charging are you referring to? No one I know who drives and EV even wants that - it is a meaningless "solution" in search of a problem.

And what does wireless charging have to do with battery degradation and/or quick charging? I fail to see why you brought it up.

Originally Posted by jamesqf

No, I'm comparing vehicles I could buy now, that would meet my need for a roughly 200 mile range. The ability to fit 7 people in a Tesla is not a plus to me*, because I only rarely have even one other person riding with me - and observation suggests that this is in fact the norm.

(*In fact it's a negative, since I don't want to drive something that big.)

You keep reminding us that you need the range tat we will be getting in about 2 months, with the Chevy Bolt EV. We've got it.

I agree with you that the Model S is too big, for I want, as well.

Originally Posted by jamesqf

Circular argument. EVs are charged at home because the people who have them are mostly the ones who don't need more range than they get on a single charge. Which is great for them, not so great for those who need more range.

EV's can work for a vast majority of people - and quick charging is NOT required very often. Quick chargers will allow EVEN MORE people to drive and EV.

Originally Posted by jamesqf

No, that's NOT what it means in the context of this discussion. It means that the EV will not have the range (with reasonable reserve) that meets a potential buyer's needs..

If you can't drive an EV because they don't meet your needs - and you are NOT DRIVING an EV - then that is NOT "range anxiety".

[jamesqf]

Originally Posted by NeilBlanchard

Look - quick charging does not noticeably harm the battery.

Where's the evidence of that? Charging creates heat, because the process is not perfectly efficient. (Basic chemistry/thermodynamics, no?) Charge faster, you create at least the same total amount of heat, and probably more because resistance increases with temperature. And in fact there is research showing such degradation in lithium batteries, for instance these: Effect of Temperature on the Aging rate of Li Ion Battery Operating above Room Temperature : Scientific Reports BU-502: Discharging at High and Low Temperatures – Battery University

What "hype" about wireless charging are you referring to?

About 12 million hits on Google worth of hype :-)

And what does wireless charging have to do with battery degradation and/or quick charging? I fail to see why you brought it up.

Because it's another example of how EVs can be used wastefully.

You keep reminding us that you need the range tat we will be getting in about 2 months, with the Chevy Bolt EV. We've got it.

No, we don't have it. We may get it in a few months (if GM has been honest with us), but that doesn't apply when we're discussing things we can go out and buy today.

If you can't drive an EV because they don't meet your needs - and you are NOT DRIVING an EV - then that is NOT "range anxiety".

No, it's the reason I'm not driving an EV. (Or one of them: I freely admit that I'm rather reluctant to spend upwards of $30K on a vehicle, and really don't want to deal with 'infotainment' systems or controls run by touch screens.)

[oil pan 4]

GM? Honest?
LOL