1997 Civic CX to HX engine/VX trans swap! 63 MPG @ 62 MPH

[turbovr41991]

Contact info I have

Brent Hodges 614-760-8552 northwestautomotivesolutions@yahoo.com
Justin Keys 614-560-3397
Hillary Keys 614-504-5357

Northwest Automotive Solutions
8168 Business Way Ste. D
Plain City, Ohio 43064
Not sure what this number is…. Mobile (614) 477-1261

Brent was really easy to deal with and seemed to know a lot about the swapping of the cars. He was also the most responsive. But he said it is just him working and it is hard to answer the phone while he works. He normally gets back to me within a day or two.

I have been really busy lately, but wanted to let everyone know the car is still doing great and getting amazing mpg!

[MakitaDiesel]

Thanks for the info, we have roughly the same setup ('97 DX Hatch, HX engine/wheels, $25 '95 CX trans I refreshed with new bearings, grill block, Tein S.techs, Koni Yellow/Tokico white combo, etc but I have a 6-pt. chromoly roll cage) minus the mirrors, kill switch, & tune. After a brief 1000 mile test mule run, she gets 50 mpg give or take. I don't use any EOC or what I'd refer to as advanced hypermile techniques, just an Ultragauge + vacuum gauge to give me an idea of how much foot I need to plant, unless of course I'm late then all bets are off & I make mother nature cry. I'll give them a call whenever the O2 goes out or the EGR acts up too much & probably come out ahead vs. buying a new O2.

Mak

P.S. Do you have any current pics of your ride turbovr41991? Just curious to see how my car twin looks.

[turbovr41991]

I normally just email Brent, but he says he responds to phone/ voicemail as well.

With the tuned ECU I now use tunerview 2 and an MPGuino. That combo seems to be ideal for monitoring. With running lean all the time, I constantly monitor water temp as it creates a lot of heat. I was running near 200 degrees a lot, so I moved my grill block air intake to the side of the radiator and now temps stay around 190-194.

A kill switch is probably the best mod you can do. Start using it when you are coasting off an exit ramp. It is shocking how much gas that saves. I used to use DFCO, but the kill switch allows for a longer coast and is less wear and tear on the drivetrain.

I really don't have any newer pictures, but there should be plenty of older ones in this thread. I probably should take some new pictures of it. I got my hands on some brand new OEM Honda headlights and they look amazing. No more headlight polishing for me!











I have been really busy at work and doing house projects. Big plans to do a belly pan and kamback, but need to find time to do it.

[figit090]

Originally Posted by turbovr41991

I normally just email Brent, but he says he responds to phone/ voicemail as well.

With the tuned ECU I now use tunerview 2 and an MPGuino. That combo seems to be ideal for monitoring. With running lean all the time, I constantly monitor water temp as it creates a lot of heat. I was running near 200 degrees a lot, so I moved my grill block air intake to the side of the radiator and now temps stay around 190-194.

A kill switch is probably the best mod you can do. Start using it when you are coasting off an exit ramp. It is shocking how much gas that saves. I used to use DFCO, but the kill switch allows for a longer coast and is less wear and tear on the drivetrain.

I really don't have any newer pictures, but there should be plenty of older ones in this thread. I probably should take some new pictures of it. I got my hands on some brand new OEM Honda headlights and they look amazing. No more headlight polishing for me!

I have been really busy at work and doing house projects. Big plans to do a belly pan and kamback, but need to find time to do it.

Nice car, it looks great! I'm a fan of stock-looking cars that aren't mutililated or reminiscent of something you'd see on a test track or an aerospace testing lab, great job!

[hackish]

Originally Posted by turbovr41991

With the tuned ECU I now use tunerview 2 and an MPGuino. That combo seems to be ideal for monitoring. With running lean all the time, I constantly monitor water temp as it creates a lot of heat. I was running near 200 degrees a lot, so I moved my grill block air intake to the side of the radiator and now temps stay around 190-194.

Running LOP creates less heat, not more. In traffic and from 10+ years of working on and tuning hondas I'd say 190 is usually the most you should see. The AT cars run a little hotter but very few people want their slushboxes tuned.

You could check on the water pump but generally they either work or leak. Most often I have seen plugged rads. Just a replacement stocker could be a good choice. If you check the AT ones are usually dual core not single but even the single core honda rad is sufficient to cool most 300hp turbo engines so it should have no problems with yours. The black plastic beside the rad is also important so make sure it's in there.

Which tuned ECU are you using? One of the marvels of the VX was it's EGR but I never had the time to finish building a def to edit a P07. If you're using tunerview I assume the ecu was tuned with neptune?

Originally Posted by turbovr41991

A kill switch is probably the best mod you can do. Start using it when you are coasting off an exit ramp. It is shocking how much gas that saves. I used to use DFCO, but the kill switch allows for a longer coast and is less wear and tear on the drivetrain.

The purpose of DFCO was to save fuel and help slow the car. I agree that engine off out of gear makes better use of your kinetic energy but it puts a lot more wear on your drivetrain.

Before I got out of the mechanical business there were a few guys with the cutoff switches in town and continually bump starting their hondas kept breaking the springs in their clutches (more technically the pressure plate spring tabs). Also, popping it in and out of gear at speed killed the syncros.

Originally Posted by turbovr41991

I really don't have any newer pictures, but there should be plenty of older ones in this thread. I probably should take some new pictures of it. I got my hands on some brand new OEM Honda headlights and they look amazing. No more headlight polishing for me!

I have been really busy at work and doing house projects. Big plans to do a belly pan and kamback, but need to find time to do it.

Another power saver you might try is adding HIDs. They are cheap now but it's difficult to get a good quality set. The digital ballasts usually pull about 35-40w whereas the normal bulbs pull about 110w.

One last point about killing the engine when you're rolling, it's a good idea to install an EGT probe in your cat. If you drop below 600 degrees then restart the engine otherwise you'll be a pulse and pollute driver. I did some tester to figure out how badly pulse and glide polluted but unfortunately it would always peg my 5 gas analyzer as soon as the cat dropped below operating temp. Saving fuel is one thing but at the expense of polluting more than 10 cars is another.

This is not as bad on newer cars as they monitor cat temp as you drive and on a restart it goes into relight mode and dumps a ton of extra fuel and pulls timing to light the cat again.

-Michael

[Baltothewolf]

Originally Posted by hackish

One last point about killing the engine when you're rolling, it's a good idea to install an EGT probe in your cat. If you drop below 600 degrees then restart the engine otherwise you'll be a pulse and pollute driver. I did some tester to figure out how badly pulse and glide polluted but unfortunately it would always peg my 5 gas analyzer as soon as the cat dropped below operating temp. Saving fuel is one thing but at the expense of polluting more than 10 cars is another.

This is not as bad on newer cars as they monitor cat temp as you drive and on a restart it goes into relight mode and dumps a ton of extra fuel and pulls timing to light the cat again.

-Michael

Can't that also clog up and ruin your cats as well?

[hackish]

P&G may be able to clog the cat this way but I don't have any data to support it. The newer cars, I don't think so. Some countries have emissions laws covering coldstart emissions and carmakers have had a lot of work to comply. Ever notice how a number of brands have redesigned so the exhaust is on the back? That's to allow quicker cat light with a cat that's closer to the engine but not too close like the cat-attached manifolds.

I know there is a lot of info here supporting P&G but I did a little research on the pollution it creates and it was significant. I tried to get a gov't grant to evaluate it properly but they felt that although the added pollution was significant the incidence was low enough that money was better spent on other research and enforcement.

-Michael

[California98Civic]

Two points responding to hackish's comments about P&G above:

Done correctly so that a passenger would not notice it, bump starting will not injure the drive train. There are lots of guys on this site with tents of thousands of miles of driving using P&G to prove that point. I've been bump starting my car for 40,000 miles maybe about once a mile on average, maybe more frequently than that. I'm still on the factory 1998 clutch. Got 219,000 miles on it. I'm not alone in that experience here... search the site.

There was also an extensive and informed debate about CAT temps and overall vehicle pollution on this site a couple years ago. Search for it. One point I would revive is pollution from a vehicle is not just about the fuel's point of use: all your fuel is shipped on intensely polluting ocean super tankers. Higher MPG through P&G boosts emissions if the cat is allowed to get cold, but higher MPG also means less business for those massively polluting tankers.

BTW, I totally agree that's a great looking car, nicely mldded too.

Cheers,
James

[jcp123]

I'm going to keep this thread in the back of my mind, the Echo is well worn and will probably be replaced in a year or two... I'd like something like this.

[Ecky]

Originally Posted by California98Civic

There was also an extensive and informed debate about CAT temps and overall vehicle pollution on this site a couple years ago. Search for it. One point I would revive is pollution from a vehicle is not just about the fuel's point of use: all your fuel is shipped on intensely polluting ocean super tankers. Higher MPG through P&G boosts emissions if the cat is allowed to get cold, but higher MPG also means less business for those massively polluting tankers.

I haven't read the thread, but that's an excellent point. There's definitely a problem with emissions testing methodology when it looks at PPM and not the actual amount of pollution.