Go Back   EcoModder Forum > Off-Topic > The Lounge
Register Now
 Register Now
 

Closed Thread  Post New Thread
 
Submit Tools LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 02-05-2019, 04:06 PM   #4821 (permalink)
EV convert
 
oil pan 4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: NewMexico (USA)
Posts: 8,694

Sub - '84 Chevy Diesel Suburban C10
SUV
90 day: 19.5 mpg (US)

camaro - '85 Chevy Camaro Z28

Riot - '03 Kia Rio POS
Team Hyundai
90 day: 30.21 mpg (US)

Bug - '01 VW Beetle GLSturbo
90 day: 26.43 mpg (US)

Sub2500 - '86 GMC Suburban C2500
90 day: 11.95 mpg (US)

Snow flake - '11 Nissan Leaf SL
SUV
90 day: 141.63 mpg (US)
Thanks: 210
Thanked 2,871 Times in 2,246 Posts
Storage is not cheap.
If I go off grid the largest expenditure by far will be the batteries.
Your blind optimism isn't fooling anyone.

You say "nuclear is more expensive" it's not more expensive than wind that doesn't work at night covered by batteries that are unaffordable. There's no way to build enough batteries to cover the power that could be produced by a nuclear plant at night, cost less than a nuclear power plant and last 40 or 50 years.

__________________
1984 chevy suburban, custom made 6.5L diesel turbocharged with a Garrett T76 and Holset HE351VE, 22:1 compression 13psi of intercooled boost.
1989 firebird mostly stock. Aside from the 6-speed manual trans, corvette gen 5 front brakes, 1LE drive shaft, 4th Gen disc brake fbody rear end.
2011 leaf SL, white, portable 240v CHAdeMO, trailer hitch, new batt as of 2014.
 
The Following User Says Thank You to oil pan 4 For This Useful Post:
aerohead (02-09-2019)
Alt Today
Popular topics

Other popular topics in this forum...

   
Old 02-05-2019, 04:34 PM   #4822 (permalink)
EcoModding Newb
 
redpoint5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Oregon
Posts: 7,979

Acura TSX - '06 Acura TSX
90 day: 26.38 mpg (US)

Lafawnda - '01 Honda CBR600 F4i
90 day: 47.32 mpg (US)

Big Yeller - '98 Dodge Ram 2500 base
90 day: 21.82 mpg (US)

Prius Plug-in - '12 Toyota Prius Plug-in
90 day: 57.64 mpg (US)

Mazda CX-5 - '17 Mazda CX-5 Touring
90 day: 28.63 mpg (US)
Thanks: 2,641
Thanked 3,132 Times in 2,332 Posts
Nuke plants can go 100 years, they just haven't been around long enough to prove it yet.
__________________
Gas and Electric Vehicle Cost of Ownership Calculator







Give me absolute safety, or give me death!
 
The Following User Says Thank You to redpoint5 For This Useful Post:
aerohead (02-06-2019)
Old 02-05-2019, 05:33 PM   #4823 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
redneck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: SC Lowcountry
Posts: 1,343

Geo XL1 - '94 Geo Metro
Team Metro
Boat tails and more mods
90 day: 72.22 mpg (US)

Big, Bad & Flat - '01 Dodge Ram 3500 SLT
Team Cummins
90 day: 21.13 mpg (US)
Thanks: 180
Thanked 1,109 Times in 534 Posts
.

Former Tesla workers have provided worrying accounts of the current state of the company’s production plant in Buffalo, New York.

https://www.breitbart.com/tech/2019/...ated-for-show/


Dwindling sales.

Quote:
Tesla reported a 21 percent decrease in installed solar systems for the fourth quarter which appeared to add to the lack of production at the facility. Dale Witherell and another worker, Dennis Scott, saw the slow production rate at the factory firsthand: “We’re paid for 12 hours to work, not watch movies,” Scott said. Witherell added: “During my employment there, nothing improved during the entire employment as far as production.”

Witherell continued to say: “Some weeks we produced enough solar modules for zero homes and probably the best I saw was maybe four homes in a week, so that is alarmingly scary to obviously be a part of a company who doesn’t have any sense of urgency to tackle these issues and get them working correctly.”

When it comes to production, Tesla knows how to talk the talk but doesn't know how to walk the walk.




 
Old 02-05-2019, 05:45 PM   #4824 (permalink)
In the fasting lane
 
RedDevil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Nieuwegein, the Netherlands
Posts: 3,723

Red Devil - '11 Honda Insight Elegance
Team Honda
90 day: 55.45 mpg (US)

It - '09 Hyundai I10 Active Cool
Team Hyundai
90 day: 28.5 mpg (US)
Thanks: 1,505
Thanked 2,040 Times in 1,312 Posts
A Tesla car battery can store as much electricity as my house needs in 10 days. That would see it through many a sunless and windless night.
It is entirely possible, but admittedly quite expensive.

Then it would be stupid to have every house equipped with big batteries. There's a grid, and the wider it cooperates the lesser the variations will be - not zero, absolutely not; but much less than local.
Strategically placed units on the grid can be cheaper, smaller in total and much more effective. They could f.i. also help improve the electric phase integrity.
Many EVs will be hooked up to the grid at any one time. They can be charged 'smart' when beyond a certain minimal level or even provide a buffer to optimize supply and demand.
__________________
2011 Honda Insight + HID, LEDs, tiny PV panel, extra brake pad return springs, neutral wheel alignment, 44/42 PSI (air), PHEV light (inop), tightened wheel nut.
lifetime FE over 0.16 Gmeter or 0.1 Mmile.



Most people are in the longest queue.

Last edited by RedDevil; 02-05-2019 at 05:58 PM..
 
The Following User Says Thank You to RedDevil For This Useful Post:
aerohead (02-06-2019)
Old 02-05-2019, 06:21 PM   #4825 (permalink)
EV convert
 
oil pan 4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: NewMexico (USA)
Posts: 8,694

Sub - '84 Chevy Diesel Suburban C10
SUV
90 day: 19.5 mpg (US)

camaro - '85 Chevy Camaro Z28

Riot - '03 Kia Rio POS
Team Hyundai
90 day: 30.21 mpg (US)

Bug - '01 VW Beetle GLSturbo
90 day: 26.43 mpg (US)

Sub2500 - '86 GMC Suburban C2500
90 day: 11.95 mpg (US)

Snow flake - '11 Nissan Leaf SL
SUV
90 day: 141.63 mpg (US)
Thanks: 210
Thanked 2,871 Times in 2,246 Posts
Maine Yankee nuclear power station, the one I am most familiar with as some of dad's family built it only lasted about 30 years I was going with worst case scenario.

The steam line coming out of the reactor cracked because they used a very unusual explosive welding technique to connect the reactor core to the super heated water outlet pipes.
It saved 2 or 3 weeks of welding, but cut the life of the plant in half because when it cracks it was pretty much impossible to repair. If the titanium sleeve to stainless steel pipe bond bond broke then there is no way to repair it.
A reactor core leak on PWR like that is really not good.

The thing that did maine Yankee in was an engineering design flaw.
My dads family that worked on it were just stupid welders.
Funny thing is if they let the stupid welders do their job instead of let the engineers try something new, cool and fun that nuclear power plants would still be going.
__________________
1984 chevy suburban, custom made 6.5L diesel turbocharged with a Garrett T76 and Holset HE351VE, 22:1 compression 13psi of intercooled boost.
1989 firebird mostly stock. Aside from the 6-speed manual trans, corvette gen 5 front brakes, 1LE drive shaft, 4th Gen disc brake fbody rear end.
2011 leaf SL, white, portable 240v CHAdeMO, trailer hitch, new batt as of 2014.

Last edited by oil pan 4; 02-05-2019 at 07:11 PM..
 
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to oil pan 4 For This Useful Post:
aerohead (02-06-2019), freebeard (02-05-2019)
Old 02-05-2019, 06:35 PM   #4826 (permalink)
EcoModding Newb
 
redpoint5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Oregon
Posts: 7,979

Acura TSX - '06 Acura TSX
90 day: 26.38 mpg (US)

Lafawnda - '01 Honda CBR600 F4i
90 day: 47.32 mpg (US)

Big Yeller - '98 Dodge Ram 2500 base
90 day: 21.82 mpg (US)

Prius Plug-in - '12 Toyota Prius Plug-in
90 day: 57.64 mpg (US)

Mazda CX-5 - '17 Mazda CX-5 Touring
90 day: 28.63 mpg (US)
Thanks: 2,641
Thanked 3,132 Times in 2,332 Posts
That's what I'm talking about RD. I'd love to see grid connected EVs be part of the storage solution to the renewable problem.

Incentivize the EV owners to charge during excess renewable generation or off-peak, and incentivize them to sell back a portion of the energy when there's not enough renewable energy or during peak use.
__________________
Gas and Electric Vehicle Cost of Ownership Calculator







Give me absolute safety, or give me death!
 
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to redpoint5 For This Useful Post:
aerohead (02-06-2019), RedDevil (02-06-2019)
Old 02-05-2019, 07:16 PM   #4827 (permalink)
EV convert
 
oil pan 4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: NewMexico (USA)
Posts: 8,694

Sub - '84 Chevy Diesel Suburban C10
SUV
90 day: 19.5 mpg (US)

camaro - '85 Chevy Camaro Z28

Riot - '03 Kia Rio POS
Team Hyundai
90 day: 30.21 mpg (US)

Bug - '01 VW Beetle GLSturbo
90 day: 26.43 mpg (US)

Sub2500 - '86 GMC Suburban C2500
90 day: 11.95 mpg (US)

Snow flake - '11 Nissan Leaf SL
SUV
90 day: 141.63 mpg (US)
Thanks: 210
Thanked 2,871 Times in 2,246 Posts
I'm not connecting my EV to help power the power grid.


Plus right now the only vehicle to grid protocol is chademo. The cheapest home chademo charger is about $3,500 and doesn't do vehicle to grid.
Who's going pay $3,500 or more just to wear their battery out faster?
__________________
1984 chevy suburban, custom made 6.5L diesel turbocharged with a Garrett T76 and Holset HE351VE, 22:1 compression 13psi of intercooled boost.
1989 firebird mostly stock. Aside from the 6-speed manual trans, corvette gen 5 front brakes, 1LE drive shaft, 4th Gen disc brake fbody rear end.
2011 leaf SL, white, portable 240v CHAdeMO, trailer hitch, new batt as of 2014.
 
The Following User Says Thank You to oil pan 4 For This Useful Post:
aerohead (02-09-2019)
Old 02-05-2019, 07:41 PM   #4828 (permalink)
EcoModding Newb
 
redpoint5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Oregon
Posts: 7,979

Acura TSX - '06 Acura TSX
90 day: 26.38 mpg (US)

Lafawnda - '01 Honda CBR600 F4i
90 day: 47.32 mpg (US)

Big Yeller - '98 Dodge Ram 2500 base
90 day: 21.82 mpg (US)

Prius Plug-in - '12 Toyota Prius Plug-in
90 day: 57.64 mpg (US)

Mazda CX-5 - '17 Mazda CX-5 Touring
90 day: 28.63 mpg (US)
Thanks: 2,641
Thanked 3,132 Times in 2,332 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by oil pan 4 View Post
I'm not connecting my EV to help power the power grid.


Plus right now the only vehicle to grid protocol is chademo. The cheapest home chademo charger is about $3,500 and doesn't do vehicle to grid.
Who's going pay $3,500 or more just to wear their battery out faster?
There would need to be a new standard for sure. but most all electrical components needed to do vehicle to grid are already in every vehicle. The onboard charger that converts 240v AC to ~400v DC could be used to push the other direction.

What would then be needed is for the vehicle to be internet connected so that charging/discharging could be remotely controlled on demand. Many vehicles are already internet connected.

It would be an opt-in sort of thing where with a phone app, you decide if or when you're participating in grid leveling and what state of charge range you're willing to utilize.

I'd happily sell 20 kWh of a 60 kWh battery at 10 cents each, making $2 per day in the process. That's $730 a year and not much wear on the battery. Imagine charging your EV at $0.05/kWh and selling power back at $0.15/kWh. I like the idea of a passive income on assets already owned, even if it is small.

I wouldn't participate either if my EV only had 23 kWh and no active thermal management. In the future, 40 kWh will be the smallest size EV battery. That leaves plenty of buffer for the typical owner to sell some energy back to the grid.

People already participate in sharing their under-utilized resources in projects like SETI at home, where an idle computer crunches numbers. Those participants don't even get compensated, so just think how popular grid leveling would be if there were incentive.

Heck, my average household electrical consumption is somewhere around 15 kWh. 1 EV alone could run 2 houses for a day.
__________________
Gas and Electric Vehicle Cost of Ownership Calculator







Give me absolute safety, or give me death!

Last edited by redpoint5; 02-05-2019 at 07:49 PM..
 
The Following User Says Thank You to redpoint5 For This Useful Post:
aerohead (02-06-2019)
Old 02-05-2019, 08:16 PM   #4829 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
redneck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: SC Lowcountry
Posts: 1,343

Geo XL1 - '94 Geo Metro
Team Metro
Boat tails and more mods
90 day: 72.22 mpg (US)

Big, Bad & Flat - '01 Dodge Ram 3500 SLT
Team Cummins
90 day: 21.13 mpg (US)
Thanks: 180
Thanked 1,109 Times in 534 Posts
.

Teslas Solar city in Buffalo NY is the largest PV cell and module factory in the Western Hemisphere.

It was supposed to produce 1 gigawatt worth of panels a yr. by the end of 2018 and 2 gigawatts per yr. by the end of 2019.

It is no where near making even a fraction of what was proposed.


Local coverage with video that shows inside of plant.

https://www.wivb.com/news/investigat...ant/1754568826


However, there may be a glimmer of light .

Quote:
There was no mention of the potential of manufacturing a new product in Buffalo, but former Tesla employees said that managers in Buffalo recently showed off a new product. One described it as energy storage battery systems for utilities and commercial businesses.

“We came in for the start of one of our shifts about a month ago – it was some time in December – and the plant manager was there and unveiled a curtain over a large container,” Witherell said.

“He said the goal was in June to be having a line at Gigafactory II producing [the new product]. I believe they are trying to do whatever they can because of the failing solar modules.”

Tesla declined to comment on the new product.

It may have something to do with of Teslas purchase of Maxwell and their line of super capacitors.

I’m not posting Teslas problems to make fun of them.

I want them to succeed...

What it does show however, is that transitioning from fossil to renewable energy is not as easy as it sounds or made out to be.




>
 
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to redneck For This Useful Post:
aerohead (02-06-2019), redpoint5 (02-05-2019)
Old 02-05-2019, 09:39 PM   #4830 (permalink)
EV convert
 
oil pan 4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: NewMexico (USA)
Posts: 8,694

Sub - '84 Chevy Diesel Suburban C10
SUV
90 day: 19.5 mpg (US)

camaro - '85 Chevy Camaro Z28

Riot - '03 Kia Rio POS
Team Hyundai
90 day: 30.21 mpg (US)

Bug - '01 VW Beetle GLSturbo
90 day: 26.43 mpg (US)

Sub2500 - '86 GMC Suburban C2500
90 day: 11.95 mpg (US)

Snow flake - '11 Nissan Leaf SL
SUV
90 day: 141.63 mpg (US)
Thanks: 210
Thanked 2,871 Times in 2,246 Posts
Yeah some people just think turning off nuclear power plants, building some solar panels and wind turbines fixes everything.

Quote:
Originally Posted by redpoint5 View Post
There would need to be a new standard for sure. but most all electrical components needed to do vehicle to grid are already in every vehicle. The onboard charger that converts 240v AC to ~400v DC could be used to push the other direction.

What would then be needed is for the vehicle to be internet connected so that charging/discharging could be remotely controlled on demand. Many vehicles are already internet connected.

It would be an opt-in sort of thing where with a phone app, you decide if or when you're participating in grid leveling and what state of charge range you're willing to utilize.

I'd happily sell 20 kWh of a 60 kWh battery at 10 cents each, making $2 per day in the process. That's $730 a year and not much wear on the battery. Imagine charging your EV at $0.05/kWh and selling power back at $0.15/kWh. I like the idea of a passive income on assets already owned, even if it is small.

I wouldn't participate either if my EV only had 23 kWh and no active thermal management. In the future, 40 kWh will be the smallest size EV battery. That leaves plenty of buffer for the typical owner to sell some energy back to the grid.

People already participate in sharing their under-utilized resources in projects like SETI at home, where an idle computer crunches numbers. Those participants don't even get compensated, so just think how popular grid leveling would be if there were incentive.

Heck, my average household electrical consumption is somewhere around 15 kWh. 1 EV alone could run 2 houses for a day.
The j1772 protocol only allows for 1 way power flow.
CCS, same thing.
Still there is the problem of the cost of the unit which is not cheap.

__________________
1984 chevy suburban, custom made 6.5L diesel turbocharged with a Garrett T76 and Holset HE351VE, 22:1 compression 13psi of intercooled boost.
1989 firebird mostly stock. Aside from the 6-speed manual trans, corvette gen 5 front brakes, 1LE drive shaft, 4th Gen disc brake fbody rear end.
2011 leaf SL, white, portable 240v CHAdeMO, trailer hitch, new batt as of 2014.
 
The Following User Says Thank You to oil pan 4 For This Useful Post:
aerohead (02-06-2019)
Closed Thread  Post New Thread


Tags
lies, opinion, reality, scam

Thread Tools




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.5.2
All content copyright EcoModder.com