Engineering Explained:Why Tesla's Are Bad at Towing

[redpoint5]

What about an inflatable enclosure whose size is dictated by straps? Set the strap length to accommodate the height required by the load, and then inflate. Have a relief valve as a precaution against overinflation, and an active pump that will kick on whenever more air is needed. Perhaps it would require too many straps to keep from bubbling.

Originally Posted by Xist

I'm offended! It's called "Death by cancelation!"

Oh no, I enjoy flirting with Death and then giving the cold shoulder too much.

When I die, know that it positively was not self-cancellation.

[freebeard]

Oh no, I enjoy flirting with Death ...

That's charitable. I read it as "I wish you were cancelled!".

The philosopher with the Simultaneous Sip has been saying that not caring about when people get offended is a Superpower. It's only electrical signals in someone else's head.

Originally Posted by Hersbird

I do think an Airstream type could be made less expensive

I live in one of those -- a Mobile Industrial Southern Pacific trailer. It's like an Argosy with fiberglass end caps and cheap cabinets.

If I were able to build a new trailer, it would have 2ea 5x10ft Polymetal sheets forming an inverted U-shape with a single seam in the top center in a 5ft module. The floor would be framed just like the Silver Streak Clipper I had for years, a single tube down the center with carriage bolts at the ends of the C-channel crossmembers.

[redpoint5]

Originally Posted by freebeard

The philosopher with the Simultaneous Sip has been saying that not caring about when people get offended is a Superpower. It's only electrical signals in someone else's head.

It's scary how similar I am with that philosopher in method of reason and temperament. If only my skill stack were as well formed.

It's not so much that I don't care if others get offended, it's that offending people is how to love them. First, it gives them (and me) an opportunity to grow, and second it establishes honesty with them whereas those who are unwilling to offend are dishonest by omission. It also signals permission to offend back (among the reasons I admire aerohead).

I realize many (most?) would prefer fake relationships that are paper thin and collapse at the slightest injury, but those are worthless. If people aren't offending, they don't care, and that says more about their character than anything else.

If one feels comfortable, that should be their discomfort, because nothing is more corrosive than comfort.

[rmay635703]

Originally Posted by ksa8907

TLDR

Electric towing will be limited to local deliveries and day cab trucks. Heavy and long distance transport will be diesel and natural gas for a long time.

Electric freight towing was done over a hundred years ago on an overhead electric train, no battery needed.

Semis are really quite terrible for moving freight across the nation, too bad we have let our train system and operators become incompetent and simply subsidize semis so we don’t think we bear their hidden costs.

[freebeard]

At the turn of the last Century, electric railroads traversed both sides of the Willamette River.

www.oregonencyclopedia.org/.../oregon_electric_railway/


OR Elec, Eugene depot, 1912. Oregon Electric train at Eugene depot, 1912. Courtesy Mark Moore

(That station in Eugene is completely restored and used by Amtrak today)

Rolling stock included combination baggage, smoking, and passenger motorcars; observation-buffet cars; and elegant passenger trailers. For a few years, there were also specially built interurban sleeping cars. Because it did not take all night to make the trip between Portland and Eugene, these cars were shunted onto side tracks so patrons could sleep until morning.

In the beginning, operating costs were reasonable, but reductions in service had to be made when passenger volume did not develop as expected. After a peak year in 1920, competition from automobiles, trucks, and buses steadily eroded revenue*. Passenger service to Corvallis was discontinued in 1931 and to Forest Grove in 1932. All passenger service ceased on May 13, 1933. The Oregon Electric survived as a freight railroad into the 1990s. Electric locomotives were used until July 10, 1945.

The West side:

Oregon RailRoad History - PNWC-NRHS
https://www.pnwc-nrhs.org › oregon-rr-history.html
The Valley & Siletz Railroad operated from a point on the Willamette River near Independence to the city of Valsetz. The Willamette Valley Railroad operated a small part of the old V&S during the 1980's. The Willamina & Grande Ronde operated the line west from Willamina, before that was taken over by the Hampton Railroad.

The Valley and Siletz Railroad - Abandoned Rails
https://www.abandonedrails.com › valley-and-siletz-railroad
In 1930, an attempts was made by the Oregon Electric Railway to purchase the railroad and construct an extension over the Willamette River to their main line to Eugene. The Cobbs & Mitchell company, as well as other shippers, communities and other parties supported this proposal.

Valsetz no longer exists. When I was in high school we played against them in B Minor league.

*See the Great Streetcar Conspiracy. It was GM and Standard Oil.

General Motors streetcar conspiracy
The General Motors streetcar conspiracy refers to convictions of General Motors and other companies that were involved in monopolizing the sale of buses and supplies to National City Lines and its subsidiaries, and to allegations that the defendants conspired to own or control transit systems, in violation of Section 1 of the Sherman Antitrust Act.Wikipedia

[Piotrsko]

The down side to rail cars for frieght is you need a spur to your special loading dock. NYC was developed around rail so they didn't need as many box trucks. Hard to do in LA or even Reno today after the warehouses are built scattered into available spaces.

Even scarier is modern drivers intermixing with freight cars on public streets, they have enough difficulty with busses and trucks. Perhaps Darwin's application could solve that issue.

[JSH]

Originally Posted by Hersbird

To me Eco means economy, but to others it means ecology. Very clever name whoever came up with it.

I personally think improved economy gives you improved ecology on the big scale. Of course you can improve ecology by spending too but there is a limit if you approach it that way.

There is a mixed group here on EcoModder.

There are those were maximizing MPG is the goal. They will spend $500 to save 0.25 mpg and burn more gas than they save doing ABA test runs to prove the fuel savings. They are like drag racers chasing another 0.1 second quicker 1/4 mile.

There are those that are all about saving money and would burn tires to save the $2 disposal fee or spend 10 hours to refurbish a $10 part. The equivalent of the guys that pull and straighten nails from an old project.

There are those that are all about minimizing their carbon footprint and will spend lots of time and money to do burn less fuel and are willing to make lots of compromises to practicality along the way.


So far we seem to get along pretty well - better than most internet forums at least.

[aerohead]

Originally Posted by freebeard

Made me look.

"17. I hope for fusion one day too. It's not enough to have an idea, it must become reality."

So you are both pinning your hopes on some science fiction pipe dream, when Thorium fission has been demonstrated since 1957. I don't know why I put up with this place.

I find nothing in the post about this climate change theory you espouse. Electric vehicles came first. And Wally Byam did something about it.



Hawley Bolus did something about it.





If it triples or quadruples the price you are doing it wrong. If it increases instead of decreases the drag you are doing it wrong. Make the horses lay down for the trip. Sedate them if needed.

No waiting! It's called solar energy. Fusion-sourced. Delivered for free, 24-7-365.
No geo-prospecting
No wells.
No dry holes.
No million orphaned oilwell SUPERFUND cost to be borne by taxpayers.
No artificial lift
No pipeline ruptures.
No electron supertankers running ashore.
No deepwater drilling explosions.
No ocean electron leaks killing wildlife, fouling beaches, shutting commercial fishing down.
No electron production shut down by hurricanes.
No electron refinery explosions
No electron tanker trucks.
No bulk fuel depots.
No overturned tankers closing highways down for hours.
No multi-million-dollar bridges destroyed by electron tanker fires.
No dead truck drivers.
No dead motorists killed by jack-knifing tankers.
No derailed and overturned railroad electron tank cars.
ad infinitum.
Electron-monoxide poisoning?
E V 'catalytic converters' starting wild fires?

[freebeard]

I hope for fusion one day too.

Galloping goalposts!

[hayden55]

Originally Posted by aerohead

Thanks for reminding me why we have climate change, why we had to 'invent' the electric vehicle, why we're unlikely to ever do anything about it, and why I'm within a whisker of leaving EcoModer.com.

Originally Posted by aerohead

*Reformulated E10, REGULAR UNLEADED has 111,836- Btu /gallon
* @ 3412 Btu / kWh, a gallon = 32.7772 kWh

I'm just restating the current comparison from the federal gov (USA).
1 gallon = 33.7kWh -> mpge (mpg equivalent)
Although i see they added kWh/100mi now.
https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/Find...n=sbs&id=42810
https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/Find...n=sbs&id=43821

Currently these are both still running on fossil fuels so cleanliness is probably similar for Arkansas.
But I did note on their government website they used $.126/kWh and $3.36/gal and locally it is $.135/kWh and $2.75/gal on avg (was 2.59 last week sometimes 2.89)

So 15000 miles a year for me on both are:

Tesla:$480.59 + 200 registration = 681$/yr
Prius:$736.61+100 registration = 837$/yr

At a net savings of $156/yr I don't see anything above a hybrid paying off for quite a while. The msrp on electric cars is too high for most of the 1st world country middle class, so its not going to be a solution for the rest of the world either. I really don't get the holier than thou attitude though. A lot of us on here can only afford to be so green. Most of us join to save money.
I'm convinced the only way they get people to buy EVs currently is they compare the cost of driving an EV in fuel to that of the average car (27mpg) and hope you forget cheaper hybrids also exist. The teslas are nice luxury cars but I'm okay with a cloth econo box and 0-60 in 15 seconds. lol


People will transition into renewables in due time as their wallets allow.