Ethanol in gasoline

[Christ]

Adding ANYTHING that is cheaper than gas, or even the same price, and doesn't REDUCE your MPG has increased your GAS MILEAGE.

I say this b/c:

Iif you're getting 30 MPG on gas only,
and you get 30MPG still, after adding 1 gallon of additive to a 10 gallon tank,
You are only using 9 gallons of gas, thus getting better mileage per gallon of gas.

Full gas = 30 MPG = 300 MPT = 30 MPG of gas.

Mixed = 30 MPG = 300 MPT = 300/9= 33.3 miles per gallon of gas.

You'd have to keep doing the math to figure out where it would be most economical to stop adding things to your gasoline, but if you add ANYTHING and don't lose mileage, you're still getting better efficiency... if the thing you add is cheaper than the gas you're using, you're saving money too.

Xylene is about $22 a gallon from the hardware store, hardly cost effective. (I only tried it b/c a 55 gallon drum can be had for ~$3/gallon, and if it provided ANY improvement, it would have been worth it with gas @ $3+/gallon.)

[instarx]

Originally Posted by Nevyn

Sounds rather similar to the folks that swear by the theory that acetone in proper quantity provides MASSIVE fuel economy + performance boost. supposedly, it lowers the surface tension of the gasoline, thus making it easier to burn as it's less likely to "droplet."

I don't know where the claims of acetone mileage improvements come from, and I am sceptical to say the least. If it did provide such improvements it would seem very easy to prove it, and no one has. The ethanol study however, was a real, published technical study by qualified researchers.

And Christ is right - my thinking was that a cheaper fuel that got the same MPG would decrease my cost per mile... or even a 10% cheaper fuel that got 5% less MPG would do the same. Although he is technically correct, I would not follow christ in calling it "increasing gas mileage". When people talk about gas mileage they really mean fuel mileage. Using the term gas mileage to parse out the gasoline component of a fuel mixture is unnecessarily confusing.

[Nevyn]

Here's where I read:

Acetone In Fuel Said to Increase Mileage

Directory:Acetone as a Fuel Additive - PESWiki

[instarx]

Originally Posted by Nevyn

Here's where I read:

Acetone In Fuel Said to Increase Mileage

Directory:Acetone as a Fuel Additive - PESWiki

Oh, I'm not saying there aren't people who are claiming these things about acetone, just that I don't know and I'm "vewy, vewy skeptical" without actual data. Both of these are magazine/web articles (and in fact both are from the same source - PES and PESwiki), so they're basically opinion pieces. That doesn't make them necessarily wrong, or uninteresting to think about, but in the end they're pure speculation.

Kudos for posting references though, which I haven't done, being too lazy. :-)

cheers.

[Intrigued]

Originally Posted by Christ

I contend without experiment that it would have done nothing, however, for fuel economy, as higher octane fuel does nothing unless you tune for it.

Yep! First big point: many of these additives can be used to an advantage, but you may need to do the work to GET the advantage...

Originally Posted by Christ

Adding more won't screw up your engine, and is only dangerous if not handled correctly.

Yep again. Within the word "correctly" we should remember that there would be a point where too much could cause damage - although I think Christ was inferring that!

The only problem I see is that it is way too easy for someone not set up to handle chemicals properly to end up with one of those "hey, watch this!" moments, or end up with chemicals in your body that you REALLY don't want.

So Please Be Careful, and as always: Your mileage may vary!

[Christ]

Originally Posted by Intrigued

Yep again. Within the word "correctly" we should remember that there would be a point where too much could cause damage - although I think Christ was inferring that!

The only problem I see is that it is way too easy for someone not set up to handle chemicals properly to end up with one of those "hey, watch this!" moments, or end up with chemicals in your body that you REALLY don't want.

So Please Be Careful, and as always: Your mileage may vary!

Time to add the disclaimer: Don't get hurt. If you can't handle the chemicals responsibly, please DON'T handle them at all.

Do not allow Xylol or Toluene to contact your skin, it can cause serious central nervous system damage with very little exposure.

Obviously, obtain an understand the MSDS for ANY material you're working with, BEFORE you obtain the chemical itself.

Please perform any tests in accordance with state and federal law, and don't get yourself blown up.

[Funny]

I agree with ChrisT. Above all, safety is most important when handling chemicals, especially highly flammable liquids (Gasoline, Toluene, Acetone, Xylene). Burns are among the most uncomfortable and deadly injuries one can get. Please be careful.

[Christ]

Xylene sucks in that it will burn you without being lit off. Same with Toluene.. and it only takes seconds of exposure, usually before you can get to a wash station.

I used to carry small amounts of denatured alcohol with me when working with Xylol or Toluene, in case I got it on my clothes or hands, I could easily flush it quickly with Dn-A, which is basically harmless. It will dry your skin out a bit though, and it feels COLD when you touch it, even if it's hot. Mostly b/c it evaporates so quickly, like acetone.

BTW - If you don't already know, Xylene is a brand/product name, Xylol is the chemical name. They're used interchangeably.

Another chemical that I've tested to no avail (in a lawnmower) is MEK. Methyl Ethyl Ketone. [key-tone] (obviously, a member of the Ketone [kuh-toe-knee] crime family. )

The lawnmower had an issue with pinging after being rebuilt, due to use of incorrect parts. I tested MEK in it (free to me at the time) to see if it would solve the pinging issue. No such luck. It ran fine though, you just couldn't use WOT on it, as it was basically rebuilt as a higher compression version of itself. (Yep, that was mibad.)

[Nevyn]

Originally Posted by Christ

Another chemical that I've tested to no avail (in a lawnmower) is MEK. Methyl Ethyl Ketone. [key-tone] (obviously, a member of the Ketone [kuh-toe-knee] crime family. )

Side note: MEK is a 100% guaranteed carcinogen. Don't breathe it.

[Christ]

Originally Posted by Christ

If you can't handle the chemicals responsibly, please DON'T handle them at all.

Obviously, obtain and understand the MSDS for ANY material you're working with, BEFORE you obtain the chemical itself.

Please perform any tests in accordance with state and federal law, and don't get yourself blown up.

Just thought I'd reiterate those points.

Safety equipment for these chemicals might include something along the lines of nitrile/neoprene coated safety gloves (never use latex with petroleum based products or any solvents)

Gas-exchanger mask, or respirator of some sort.

Full face-shield

non-absorbent apron and sleeve liners, with the gloves INSIDE the sleeves.

Note: These are the VERY LEAST precautions you should take.

If you're not willing to properly protect yourself, I'd prefer you just ignored everything I've posted about this subject.

EDIT - If you don't know what chemical you're handling - treat it as though it's nuclear. It could be dihydrogen monoxide (water), but it could also be something much more dangerous. Better to err on the side of personal safety, and the safety of those who might be affected by your mis-judgement.