A gift for HHO Skeptics!

[tcaud]

That's a good start, but if you continue to support environment-agnostic politicians, the damage they allow to our public lands will far outstrip your own meager efforts.

[RustyLugNut]

Originally Posted by tcaud

Recent study showed that the rainforests have atrophied to the point that many of them are not a buffer against CO2 anymore. In fact, they are increasing their CO2 output as they shrink.

The devil is in the north. The warming temperatures are releasing methane from the tundra, which will be inflating temperatures by at least 1 degree Celsius every century (the CO2 warming studies aren't even accounting for this). The population is increasing... without control measures, it will continue to grow. Look at the USA: its population continues to burgeon by 10% decade over decade. By end of the century we'll have over 600 million people here, all enjoying high living standards. And all those people will be creating CO2... know how many full grown trees it takes to supply a human with enough oxygen for a year? 400.

You say experts disagree? Numbers dude... what are the statistics of these people and what are their comparative reputations? Actually, you just admitted that you're not informed on the subject and can't debate it. So be quiet, eh?

I'm not going to demand that you believe we're flooding the world... that's pointless if you're controlled by motivated thinking... but you are gonna have to fork over tax dollars to get the west subsidized into electric vehicles or hydrogen or something. That my friends and I do require of you. And if we don't, the Chinese and Indonesians will because they will have nothing but the hills left if we continue down this self-destructive path (don't try to say that's "thousands of years" off... I've seen the maps... it's hundreds at the latest).

. . . you are supporting my position.

And I will continue to comment as I wish as I am just as qualified as you to do so ( if not more so ).

And Links? Is your evidence based on links? Are you one of those internet degreed experts?

97% is a number all the Warming Earth Radicals use. I attend numerous affairs such as Earth Day as well as the more productive EPA open meetings. I don't know where they get that number. You might want to go ask these "experts".

And I am not supporting a "do nothing approach". I believe we should move forward pragmatically. Blindly saying the problem is only caused by fossil fueled CO2 emissions may miss other critical inputs that, in part or in whole, may doom us to the same fate.

It is like assessing an automotive problem.

I once had a Mercedes that always shifted badly. The automatic transmission showed water sludge in the pan. It had been raining so the mechanic assumed some of the seals were leaking and he replaced them. A few weeks later, the same watery sludge built up in the pan and the vehicle started shifting badly again. The mechanic suggested a transmission rebuild. Hold it. I wanted to know how water was getting into the pan before I dumped a ton of money into the repairs. I did my own digging around. It turned out to be the transmission cooler line that ran through the radiator. The radiator ran at a higher pressure than the trans-cooler and the hair-line crack I found in the internal heat-exchanger saw coolant being forced into the line. A rebuilt transmission would have been damaged in short order, even if the transmission work did need to be done.

I propose we take a complete approach to the problem instead of calling out fossil fuel CO2 as the only culprit. Yes, we need to quit using the stuff since using the fossilized stuff cleanly is problematical and it is finite. But, a better understanding of how the oceans absorb CO2 and sequester it is needed. And, as Oil Pan 4 is doing and has done, we should replant our forests and protect the ones we have. And looking into alternative energy sources is a must and that includes nuclear energy. On the whole, the same people who push the Paris Agreement are frightened of nuclear energy because they lack understanding of the state of the art of nuclear power and the science behind it.

[oil pan 4]

Just think of what the believers could accomplish if they all actually did something instead of talking about what everyone else should be doing.

[tcaud]

Only safe way to deal with nuclear waste is to lock it in a crystal. They've made batteries by enclosing waste in a diamond, but they only understand how to do that with particular isotopes.

Energy can only be released from matter. The easiest such energy to release is energy created by monolithic natural processes, whether gravity in the case of fossil fuels or solar. It's probably reasonable to use nuclear for spaceships, but elsewise we're probably better off tempering our passions. In terrestrial terms our generation (and research capacities) are limited. To truly advance we will need to conduct experiments far from the solar plane, at a perpendicular, where there is little gravitational interference.

It might be reasonable to ask what practical applications of CO2 are. If we could recycle/repurpose the gas instead of releasing it into the atmosphere, then that would be helpful.

Originally Posted by oil pan 4

Just think of what the believers could accomplish if they all actually did something instead of talking about what everyone else should be doing.

I agree with you. But how much we can accomplish alone I'm unsure of. Regarding fuel efficiency, it will avail little if efficiency gains are leveraged to keep consumption per capita constant in the name of safety. As it is, we seem to be in a race to make the most tank-like, fuel efficient and consumption stable vehicle. This situation faces believers with a choice between their own immediate safety and doing right by the environment. Or maybe not even... as new car designs seem to simply be leveraging efficiency gains into metal without direct consumer input.

The new cars are truly tank-like! A couple nights ago I saw two of them involved in an accident at an intersection. One plowed through a red light and side-rammed the other. The culprit apparently didn't feel like getting an insurance premium increase and drove off by plowing the side of the victim, leaving them to hobble along down the street somewhere. The plastic wheel skirt of one of the two had fallen off into the road and there was a pool of liquid remaining at the site of the accident, but beyond that I could see little exterior damage to either vehicle.

[Natalya]

I've done a lot in my personal life to reduce my carbon footprint but I am just one person, I don't amount to much.

- All LEDs at home
- Switched from gas guzzler V6 to hybrids plus eco mods
- Don't eat meat every day anymore
- Started buying secondhand clothes
- Don't use plastic bags at grocery store
- Reusing and recycling

I also used to bike for short distance trips but my bike got stolen. But now I live in a place where that wouldn't work.

Anyway, I feel like I've done a lot of "walking the walk" when it comes to this. But I'm only one person, it's going to take more than me.

[RustyLugNut]

Originally Posted by Natalya

I've done a lot in my personal life to reduce my carbon footprint but I am just one person, I don't amount to much.

- All LEDs at home
- Switched from gas guzzler V6 to hybrids plus eco mods
- Don't eat meat every day anymore
- Started buying secondhand clothes
- Don't use plastic bags at grocery store
- Reusing and recycling

I also used to bike for short distance trips but my bike got stolen. But now I live in a place where that wouldn't work.

Anyway, I feel like I've done a lot of "walking the walk" when it comes to this. But I'm only one person, it's going to take more than me.

I run a business. I often take a new hire under my wing for a few days.

I run him ragged as he tries to keep up with me doing all the dirty jobs around the shop from sorting and stacking the scrap metal to changing and cleaning the coolant sumps under the CNC machines and even to the vile job of cleaning the bathrooms ( I used to work as a janitor when I immigrated to this country so I am particular about those toilets )!

I then train him for the specific job he signed up for. If they haven't quit yet, they often turn out to be a great hire. When I ask my employees to do the most difficult things, I get little push back because they know I have been there too. I have done what I am asking them to do.

I was at a Hollywood function where a young starlet appeared with her vegetable oil powered Mercedes. It was nice that she was into saving our planet by using waste material in her vehicle but it became very apparent after engaging her in some discussion that she did little else to reduce her consuming lifestyle. Something as simple as recycling trash was beyond her concept. And yet, here she was speaking on the need to reduce our carbon footprint and to stop global warming. Her words rang hollow with me.

When you are a "doer", your words take on much more authority when you make a plea for action. Your deeds then are much better able to be multiplied.

[RustyLugNut]

Originally Posted by tcaud

Only safe way to deal with nuclear waste is to lock it in a crystal. They've made batteries by enclosing waste in a diamond, but they only understand how to do that with particular isotopes.

Energy can only be released from matter. The easiest such energy to release is energy created by monolithic natural processes, whether gravity in the case of fossil fuels or solar. It's probably reasonable to use nuclear for spaceships, but elsewise we're probably better off tempering our passions. In terrestrial terms our generation (and research capacities) are limited. To truly advance we will need to conduct experiments far from the solar plane, at a perpendicular, where there is little gravitational interference.

I have a strong nuclear physics background and worked with a team in the design and implementation of an accelerator during the Reagan years and . . . I have no idea what you are talking about.

[Xist]

You guys know which greenhouse gas is the byproduct of fuel cells, right?

Trying to strip the hydrogen to lower the sea level makes far less sense than stripping the salt and using the water on land.

[oil pan 4]

Originally Posted by Xist

using the water on land.

It makes too much sense, can possibly work lol

[markweatherill]

I'm seeing a flurry of ads on Facebook for 'carbon cleaning' services. It seems the systems they use are all basically HHO generators. Testimonials state fantastic mpg and power increases!
I don't know if HHO is an effective engine cleaner, but if it is, could this be where its advocates are seeing the improvements?