Hot-rodding the Toyota MGR

[e*clipse]

Originally Posted by freebeard

Edit:
e*clipse -- This may be of interest to you.

TRANSAXLE ASSY, HYBRID VEHICLE. Fits: LEXUS RX400 WAGON, STANDARD | Lexus of South Atlanta Parts

That is interesting - thanks!

I wonder how the pump is powered and what inlets/outlets they use.
Also - wow! the cost! 300+ bones for an oil cooler and nearly 70 for an air duct! But that all looks like a bargain when compared to a 600+ quid oil pump!

I guess it does make those pumps designed for racing turbos look cheap...

- E*clipse

[Astro]

I wonder how much an entire car would cost if you bought it all as parts from the dealer?

[Cyruscosmo]

When I set up my system I will use the following.

This is similar to the oil cooler I already have except the unit I have is a bit smaller. It was purpose built as an auxiliary cooler with thermostatically controlled fan. And can be mounted anywhere.
JEGS Performance Products 60346 JEGS High-Performance Transmission Coolers - Free Shipping on All Orders @ JEGS

The pump I will try out first is actually a fuel pump. The unit already has hydrocarbon-proof seals and will move quite a bit of fluid. It is a rotary vane pump and I know it will work for transmission oil as I used one in a low pressure hydraulic system on an old allis chalmers dozer that had it's pump quit.

I am not sure how hot the fluid will get but if the oil is run through the cooler first I don't think there will be a problem. Also I was thinking of using a variable DC power module like computer fans use. That way the pump motor RPM is in proportion to the temperature of the oil.
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/cr...g6EaAsMo8P8HAQ

Cyruscosmo

[Cyruscosmo]

Originally Posted by e*clipse

That is interesting - thanks!

I wonder how the pump is powered and what inlets/outlets they use.
Also - wow! the cost! 300+ bones for an oil cooler and nearly 70 for an air duct! But that all looks like a bargain when compared to a 600+ quid oil pump!

I guess it does make those pumps designed for racing turbos look cheap...

- E*clipse

Those oil scavenge pumps were actually designed for turbos mounted in places where the oil drain back was not up to spec. Also when adding turbos in applications where there were non in the first place. Like this example... APS Intercooled Twin Turbo Pontiac G8/Holden Commodore.

Those turbos would not drain back into the oil sump well if at all and need a scavenge pump to keep oil from getting into the air intake.


Cyruscosmo

[e*clipse]

Originally Posted by Cyruscosmo

Those oil scavenge pumps were actually designed for turbos mounted in places where the oil drain back was not up to spec. Also when adding turbos in applications where there were non in the first place. Like this example... APS Intercooled Twin Turbo Pontiac G8/Holden Commodore.

Those turbos would not drain back into the oil sump well if at all and need a scavenge pump to keep oil from getting into the air intake.


Cyruscosmo

That's a cool, clean application ( the Holden Commodore ). I wonder what they use for an oil pump?

Actually, I am aware of the issue; I installed a much bigger turbo than spec for the diesel engine ( also not spec ) in my truck. The turbo commonly puts out about 10psi or 12psi, with common peaks at about 18psi boost, and can peak higher than that. A major concern about the install (including exhaust manifold, intercooler, intake manifold, etc, was the problem of getting rid of the oil that was fed to the turbo. In my case, I could still rely on gravity, and just scaled up the drain. I've had no issues with oily intake air.

The reason I liked the particular pump I was referring to is reliability. Sure, it's overkill, but the motor didn't have brushes to wear out AND the care they took to make a quality oil pump was impressive. Again, if the pump is critical for the motor's lubrication (like the importance of scavaging a turbo) I would pay attention to this.

- E*clipse

[freebeard]

I wonder how the pump is powered and what inlets/outlets they use.

I wonder, too. There seems to be one oil line with no return.

As for the price, used/new=1/5 or so (with, for instance, the MGR) so the pump would be maybe $120 plus shipping from Korea.

If I get the motor mounts parts shown in the exploded drawings, I still don't get to see the body where they bolt up. It would be nice to find one in a Pick-A-Part.



My unit propped to within a few degrees and a fraction of an inch of where it needs to be. I can pass my hand between the top of the MGR and the sheet metal and the axle centerline is preserved. Next step is to shelve the MGR, remove those reinforced 'offroad' trailing arms. and baremetal the wheelwells and firewall.

A soon as I can retitle it through the DMV, I will start a build thread.

[e*clipse]

Originally Posted by freebeard

I wonder, too. There seems to be one oil line with no return.

If I get the motor mounts parts shown in the exploded drawings, I still don't get to see the body where they bolt up. It would be nice to find one in a Pick-A-Part.

My unit propped to within a few degrees and a fraction of an inch of where it needs to be. I can pass my hand between the top of the MGR and the sheet metal and the axle centerline is preserved. Next step is to shelve the MGR, remove those reinforced 'offroad' trailing arms. and baremetal the wheelwells and firewall.

freebeard, I'm confused: Are you buying the OE motor mounts??

Just wondering, 'cause it seems to me, odds are a 'Yota SUV motor mount won't fit your VW, and you'll end up having to make some adapters anyway...

It seems really close - I mean would you like a hand figuring out exactly what you need? - ( structurally speaking?)

[freebeard]

Thanks for the offer. I could just as easily have said "If I were to get the motor mounts parts shown..." My thinking is that I should use either the VW transmission mounts for their rubber bushings, or the comparable Toyota parts. And those are sized properly for the weight and torque they will carry.

The round puck at the back seems straightforward enough. That part will incorporate a trailer hitch receiver.

The crossbar (part 52380x) at the front runs over the mount with the mounting bolts pointed down. A straight bar with the bolts pointing up into the sheet metal and tied to a 4-point roll cage would be one option. Another would be to use the stock crossbar and stand it on a T-shaped leg on the stock forward transmission mount or on a bar that runs between the rear upper shock mounts. There are some handy lightening holes available there. Or both. What do you think?

The MGR has (essentially) a single mount at the rear with two wide-spread at the front and hangs from above; while the original VW transaxle is the opposite. Too bad I can't just turn it around, upside down and backwards.

[e*clipse]

Originally Posted by freebeard

Thanks for the offer. I could just as easily have said "If I were to get the motor mounts parts shown..." My thinking is that I should use either the VW transmission mounts for their rubber bushings, or the comparable Toyota parts. And those are sized properly for the weight and torque they will carry.

The round puck at the back seems straightforward enough. That part will incorporate a trailer hitch receiver.

The crossbar (part 52380x) at the front runs over the mount with the mounting bolts pointed down. A straight bar with the bolts pointing up into the sheet metal and tied to a 4-point roll cage would be one option. Another would be to use the stock crossbar and stand it on a T-shaped leg on the stock forward transmission mount or on a bar that runs between the rear upper shock mounts. There are some handy lightening holes available there. Or both. What do you think?

The MGR has (essentially) a single mount at the rear with two wide-spread at the front and hangs from above; while the original VW transaxle is the opposite. Too bad I can't just turn it around, upside down and backwards.

Looks like you've got it under control. One thing their design says to me is that the resultant load from the MGR's torque is a much greater factor than its weight. I would be very leary about attaching anything like this to the sheetmetal. The roll cage or the stock transmission mount seems like a good idea. If the stock VW transmission mount were used - assuming the transmission support is below the MGR - then the main loading from the torque could be in tension and buckling wouldn't be as much of a factor.

Also - polyurethane bushings are readily available for many motor mount applications. I used some that were made for a Mitsubishi Eclipse for my Yota Diesel conversion. The only problem is they are too stiff - you really feel the diesel. Anyway, they would probably be just fine for an electric motor.

Take care,

e*clipse

[AlexanderB]

As an aside question, do we know anything else other than the Highlander and the RX400h that came with this, or a similar style drive unit?

Because those cars didn't sell very well over here, and theres literally none in the scrap yard.

Found one on eBay for nearly $900, about $1k after shipping to my house.
Thats a bit much I think, if theres talk in this topic of getting one for less than $300.