Go Back   EcoModder Forum > EcoModding > EcoModding Central
Register Now
 Register Now
 

Reply  Post New Thread
 
Submit Tools LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 11-10-2013, 11:05 AM   #101 (permalink)
wdb
lurker's apprentice
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: the Perimeter
Posts: 858

PlainJane - '12 Toyota Tacoma Base 4WD Access Cab
90 day: 20.98 mpg (US)
Thanks: 427
Thanked 194 Times in 148 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by BongoBennie View Post
More than anything, it depends on how you drive, and while diesels do operate differently, they are still pumps. The same vehicle with a turbo motor will almost always come with a smaller engine that makes more power and if you stay off the gas, it will do better on gas... those are the facts.
What's the point of having a turbo/supercharger on an engine if you don't use it? Besides which some turbos cannot help but be used, by design. The Fiat Idea I drove in Italy had an itty bitty little turbocharger that started making boost just off idle. The engine's max torque was available at 1750 RPMs.

  Reply With Quote
Alt Today
Popular topics

Other popular topics in this forum...

   
Old 11-10-2013, 11:56 AM   #102 (permalink)
lead foot
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: United States
Posts: 92
Thanks: 2
Thanked 36 Times in 22 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by wdb View Post
What's the point of having a turbo/supercharger on an engine if you don't use it? 1750 RPMs.
This is definitely the exemption of the rule crowd, every once in a while, you need some power to pass safely, etc.
__________________
2003 Honda Off road 4x4 Insight / 2003 Civic sedan Eco K20 turbo swap (if there ever was such a thing)
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-10-2013, 12:05 PM   #103 (permalink)
In Lean Burn Mode
 
pgfpro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Pacific NW
Posts: 1,427

MisFit Talon - '91 Eagle Talon TSi
Team Turbocharged!
90 day: 41.03 mpg (US)
Thanks: 1,031
Thanked 483 Times in 315 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by wdb View Post
What's the point of having a turbo/supercharger on an engine if you don't use it? Besides which some turbos cannot help but be used, by design. The Fiat Idea I drove in Italy had an itty bitty little turbocharger that started making boost just off idle. The engine's max torque was available at 1750 RPMs.
For me it's available power on demand. When I use my Talon for work there are times i will have around 500 lbs worth of cargo. The extra power and torque (equivalent of a 6.0L) the turbo provides helps me getting on on ramps and going up mountain pass's. Then when I'm at a light engine load running on flat ground it acts like a 2.0L without the reciprocating internal mass and weight of a 6.0L.

At the track it's equivalent is around a 9L without all the torque a 9L makes, so I can run a much smaller with less internal mass transmission and drive-train. Because my engine uses HP at this point to make it fast, not the torque damaging drive-train eater a 9.0L does.
__________________
Pressure Gradient Force
The Positive Side of the Number Line

  Reply With Quote
Old 11-10-2013, 01:16 PM   #104 (permalink)
Hydrogen > EV
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: NW Ohio, United States
Posts: 2,017

Snow White and the 6.2 Dwarfs - '11 Chevrolet Corvette LT2
Last 3: 26.46 mpg (US)

Silver Flea - '05 Honda Insight
90 day: 58.96 mpg (US)
Thanks: 981
Thanked 383 Times in 279 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by pgfpro View Post
For me it's available power on demand. When I use my Talon for work there are times i will have around 500 lbs worth of cargo. The extra power and torque (equivalent of a 6.0L) the turbo provides helps me getting on on ramps and going up mountain pass's. Then when I'm at a light engine load running on flat ground it acts like a 2.0L without the reciprocating internal mass and weight of a 6.0L.

At the track it's equivalent is around a 9L without all the torque a 9L makes, so I can run a much smaller with less internal mass transmission and drive-train. Because my engine uses HP at this point to make it fast, not the torque damaging drive-train eater a 9.0L does.
PGF, I really appreciate your posts and level of intensity with your vehicle. Every community has it's own people who bring in a unique contribution, and the programming w/ ECUs and development you do is appreciated.

I liked the response (normally I "Thank" when I have nothing of value to post, but want to say I like it), but it may confuse people if they don't know how to calculate force and what torque really is.

Marine Engine Torque Vs. Horsepower | Performance Product Technologies Is a decent article, I can't find my favorite (the one that finally taught me how it works).
__________________





Best Tanks:
Mustang - 54.83 mpg (US) at the Green Grand Prix
Insight - 82.91966 mpg (US) over 818.5 miles.
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to UltArc For This Useful Post:
pgfpro (11-10-2013)
Old 11-10-2013, 04:11 PM   #105 (permalink)
lead foot
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: United States
Posts: 92
Thanks: 2
Thanked 36 Times in 22 Posts
I must say this to all of you, not only did I barge in on this thread like a bully, but 2/3s of my posts in 2 years on reading this forum are on this thread. I have learned a lot in those 2 years from this place though and it's even my home page. It's tough for me, I've been building cars for many years and at one time, Honda drag racing was my game, now I find myself more interested in fuel economy at 80mpg since that how fast I drive..... Which is why you guys are the best!!! but a bit weird.
__________________
2003 Honda Off road 4x4 Insight / 2003 Civic sedan Eco K20 turbo swap (if there ever was such a thing)
  Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to BongoBennie For This Useful Post:
pgfpro (11-10-2013), slownugly (11-10-2013)
Old 11-11-2013, 01:43 AM   #106 (permalink)
In Lean Burn Mode
 
pgfpro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Pacific NW
Posts: 1,427

MisFit Talon - '91 Eagle Talon TSi
Team Turbocharged!
90 day: 41.03 mpg (US)
Thanks: 1,031
Thanked 483 Times in 315 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by UltArc View Post
PGF, I really appreciate your posts and level of intensity with your vehicle. Every community has it's own people who bring in a unique contribution, and the programming w/ ECUs and development you do is appreciated.

I liked the response (normally I "Thank" when I have nothing of value to post, but want to say I like it), but it may confuse people if they don't know how to calculate force and what torque really is.

Marine Engine Torque Vs. Horsepower | Performance Product Technologies Is a decent article, I can't find my favorite (the one that finally taught me how it works).
Thanks that really means a lot to me!!!

I hope I don't come across as someone that thinks he's got it all figure out, because I'm really not that type of person (I'm always learning and making a ton of mistakes along the way).

I try to use my real life experience to explain my ideas and thoughts from some one that's just your average person that loves cars. I'm no engineer,lol just a manager of a local automotive paint jobber.

I have been tuning/building and racing cars since the early eighty's and then got into tuning/building turbocharged efi engines for the last 15 years.

I was about to give up on my project a few months ago, but I got the privilege to listen to Burt Rutan speak (our new neighbor here in Coeur d' Alene) at our local public library!!! He inspired me to not give up! I believe that its the people on forums like this one that will make a difference in future. People on this forum have the freedom to make cars with boat tails, kam backs, wheel covers etc. and not care what the cost analysis is, or is the body shape to much for next years consumer to handle.

So all you ecomodder's keep up the great work!!! The internet is very powerful and trust me people are watching
__________________
Pressure Gradient Force
The Positive Side of the Number Line

  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to pgfpro For This Useful Post:
ron (11-11-2013)
Old 11-11-2013, 10:11 PM   #107 (permalink)
Master Novice
 
elhigh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: SE USA - East Tennessee
Posts: 2,293

Josie - '87 Toyota Pickup
90 day: 30.49 mpg (US)

Felicia - '09 Toyota Prius Base
90 day: 50.67 mpg (US)
Thanks: 409
Thanked 598 Times in 438 Posts
I'd be curious to see what kind of mileage you get, cruising at 80. The generalisation is that we're out for maximum range; that drops off rapidly when you keep the speed up.

I might touch 70 or so on my commute home, but that's on a downhill and feathering the throttle to keep out of regen. It would also be an interesting math question to see where the dollars fall: if time is money, is speed economical? At how many dollars per hour does more speed equal a savings?

I would need more/better instrumentation to record instant and average speeds and log those against fuel economy to be able to answer those.
__________________




Lead or follow. Either is fine.
  Reply With Quote
Old 11-11-2013, 10:15 PM   #108 (permalink)
Too busy for gas stations
 
Superfuelgero's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: The intersection of TN/MS/AL
Posts: 460

Turtle - '92 Honda Civic Vx
Team Honda
90 day: 67.09 mpg (US)

Rolla - '10 Toyota Corolla Le

Beast - '91 Chevy V2500

Bus - '01 VW Eurovan MV

Speed - '93 Harley bored and storked Harley w/ turbo/ nitrous
90 day: 53.09 mpg (US)

Cal - '68 Ford Mustang GT/CS
Thanks: 87
Thanked 176 Times in 114 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by slownugly View Post
Bongo- might be easier to play around with the head gasket thickness and shaving the head. Of course watching for valve clearance is part of the deal if its going to be really tight. Could play around with some pistons but I'm sure some flycutting would be in order. I was actually thinking about building a d13 and putting a z1 head onto it. Then some custom tuning would def have to be in order but I would think it would be awesome in a light crx. The z1 swaps in those already yield 60+mpg.
That's right, flycutting wouldn't be needed with a simple deck/mill. i've ran my D15z1 with upto 6 degrees cam advance without damage.

Some of these are on my list to try (along with the knife edging and coatings). I disregarded the D13 (or D12), since gas velocities would suffer while using the D15z1 top end. Going to an adjustable WAI would be better since it will have a similar effect by decreasing the air density, as well as wall heat transfer. My plan is a air to water IC, along with a ported vacuum heat riser (possibly over winter break).

If you guys like the spoiler setup, look into CCCRacing. I have one of their outlaw rear wings that goes all the way out to the bumper edge, and is a professionally made piece (but a little over the top looking).
__________________
Shooting for 600 miles of range at 65-70 mph out of a vx.

  Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2013, 11:08 AM   #109 (permalink)
In Lean Burn Mode
 
pgfpro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Pacific NW
Posts: 1,427

MisFit Talon - '91 Eagle Talon TSi
Team Turbocharged!
90 day: 41.03 mpg (US)
Thanks: 1,031
Thanked 483 Times in 315 Posts
Shouldn't the Import Tuner Magazine Part 3 be out by now???
__________________
Pressure Gradient Force
The Positive Side of the Number Line

  Reply With Quote
Old 11-16-2013, 11:42 AM   #110 (permalink)
EcoModding Lurker
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: NEPA
Posts: 13
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
I just read these eleven pages and have 9 windows up to read and save in a new ECO-MODDER folder! I have known about this site for two years and have checked out a few of the projects here. For the past few days, I have been looking at motorcycle aerodynamics.

I have been thinking lately about picking up a Honda for a DD and Eco-modder changes. Is the Honda Civic VX the best platform to start with? I am not looking for anything more than a commuter with max mpg. Drag racing and high horse power days are behind me. Now I want to look to save money and realize that 90% of my driving is alone, but cold and rain keep me from riding my Shadow every day.

Other than reading as much as I can, where should I get the best start?

  Reply With Quote
Reply  Post New Thread


Tags
$$$, civic vx, fartcan muffler, import tuner, project sipper, ricer

Thread Tools




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.5.2
All content copyright EcoModder.com