There are a lot of assertions in there with no supporting info. I've tried to put in links before but I'm not chasing yours.
My post only contains the facts, as far as I know. Not one assertion in the entire thing. Facts are verifiable, so if you think that something I've stated is not correct, then you need to do the research. I know what I wrote is correct - if you want to reject it out of hand, then that is up to you. You are then denying the facts.
The earth is an oblate spheroid that is also affected by the gravitational pull of the ice on the Antarctic continent. The sea level south of the equator is higher than the sea level north of the equator; because the addition gravitational pull of the ice is pulling the ocean water toward Antarctica. The ice on Greenland also pulls the ocean level up around Greenland.
Those are facts too - why do I need to back them up? I am an honest and sincere person and I don't make stuff up. I am certainly mistaken on occasion, and if I'm wrong, I admit it.
Human caused climate change is the single most challenging thing that our species has ever faced - and since it is of our making, the inverse is also possible. We are causing the current changes to the climate, so we can stop causing it, too.
We can change our way of living and we must - if we want to avoid the worst effects of rapid climate change. I have never been more serious in my life.
Our children and grandchildren will curse us IF we don't try. They will curse us...
Human caused climate change is the single most challenging thing that our species has ever faced - and since it is of our making, the inverse is also possible. We are causing the current changes to the climate, so we can stop causing it, too.
We'd probably be well on the way to solving it, if it weren't for some of our other doings. We've gone from simple usury to fractional reserve banking to derivatives markets.
Bucky was always grumbling about architects and bankers.
My issue is with the way the word was first used, which you haven't really addressed. There are alternatives available which don't have such a link...
Really? Give one or two that are accurate descriptions.
Quote:
Are today's temperatures unusual ? [I]Maybe, we don't know. History suggests not - at least on a questionable local level (MWP / LIA). More open science please.
Today's temperatures aren't the issue, or the problem. It is what temperatures will be in years, decades, or centuries to come. A little less short-term thinking would be useful here, as in many another field.
Quote:
But what about the "Pause ?"
Prime example of what you don't want to call denialism. The so-called pause is a figment.
Quote:
In the medium to long term we will ensure that those in the developing world will not advance because we won't let them have cheap energy - that means kids like some of us here have in our own homes - becoming sick and possibly losing their lives to simple, treatable conditions we take for granted.
This is just fear-mongering, and groundless. Treating those conditions, or avoiding them, takes trivial amounts of energy. Most of the advances in health/lifespan seen in the last century or two are down to simple public health measures like vaccination & basic sanitation, not individual medicine.
Meanwhile access to cheap energy and other "benefits" that go along with the first world's lifestyle leads to all sorts of lifestyle diseases, from obesity to allergies to tobacco-induced lung cancers.
Quote:
On the other hand we could focus on learning what is happening and going to happen, and mitigate for it.
Well, we (that is, those climate scientists) have been doing just that, and trying to tell people about it. But you folks claim it isn't happening, isn't going to happen, and will be a good thing when it does happen.
Quote:
In any case mitigation may work, prevention (by the original post here) is not going to.
Please explain how one "mitigates" the extinction of most vertebrate life.
Not that I was there, but I'm starting to suspect that the Bolsheviks were rolling for the Atlantic coast, when Mr. H. met them half-way in Poland
History suggests (its a theory based on fact ) that in 1939 the Soviet military machine was quite weak - good in numbers, poor in tactics, equipment, training, leadership (Mr S removed the clever ones) - you know, the fundamentals. During the Polish invasion from both sides the Germans reached their objectives and "stop line" way ahead of the Russians, in fact the Germans could have continued quite easily, but they had to stop and wait for the Russian side to catch up.
Alan Clark has an excellent book on it.
Another theory also suggests that the US "occupied" the UK as a base in Europe to make sure that the Russians wouldn't dominate Europe after the end of Mr H. This is kind of disputed by the fact that at the same time as Pearl Harbour in 1941 (when the US joined in), Mr H was about to occupy Moscow and defeat Mr Stalin - it was his high point. It went downhill after this.
Quote:
Originally Posted by radioranger
Man you guys are good!! ...
Confused after this bit, sorry
Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilBlanchard
My post only contains the facts, as far as I know
I've tried to include them too, I didn't include links in my last post because it was about the ideas and a position on them. I don't disrespect the ideas of those who are concerned, I just don't agree.
Apart from this we are probably closer than you think on ideas like environmentalism, wildlife, wilderness, nature, clean water, clean air, reducing our impact - and probably a load of other ideas.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilBlanchard
our children and grandchildren will curse us IF we don't try. They will curse us...
They will also curse us if we take the wrong path - spend more time at the fork in the road - maybe there is another path not yet visible.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jamesqf
...Prime example of what you don't want to call denialism. The so-called pause is a figment.
I stated a case on terms used - up to you if you understand, or don't or indeed believe the opposite.
As for the pause being a figment - prove it - with real sources.
As I have hinted before I'm unsubscribing from this. I might check later but it is doubtful. There is the option of a PM, even with a concurrant post here.
Good luck to all.
Cheers
A
__________________
[I]So long and thanks for all the fish.[/I]
When I hear super smart people like Dr. Alley speak, it not only is a mind-expanding thing, but it also makes me really appreciative that we have really good scientists working on the really big challenges.
NeilBlanchard --I accept you endorsement of Dr. Alley, but all I see is a box with "A plug-in is needed to display this content. Install plug-in" with no clickable link.
I hot-link to videos I can see and the forum software renders an unviewable version, but other people [probably running Flash™ or Java] can see them.
Xist -- I know But I was starting to get paranoid about the black helicopters, too. You gotta know when to fold 'em.
Today
Other popular topics in this forum...
) that in 1939 the Soviet military machine was quite weak - good in numbers, poor in tactics, equipment, training, leadership (Mr S removed the clever ones) - you know, the fundamentals. During the Polish invasion from both sides the Germans reached their objectives and "stop line" way ahead of the Russians, in fact the Germans could have continued quite easily, but they had to stop and wait for the Russian side to catch up.
But I was starting to get paranoid about the black helicopters, too. You gotta know when to fold 'em.
