Tesla is the largest US automaker in history

[ME_Andy]

Totally off-topic but I think that kind of real estate scheme could work. Arnold Schwarzenegger did something similar when he first arrived in the US (buying a duplex and renting half). I think you need to start with cheap homes though, especially for yourself. Property tax alone on a $500k home would torpedo the idea.

Now go do something productive to make the $20k! Also, I love how your signature still says Merry Christmas.

[RedDevil]

A funny thing about Tesla is the mentality behind their innovation drive.

Tesla is often criticized for its production methods and other things where they veer well off the well trodden ways of conventional automakers.
Tesla often tries things that fail at first. It turns out that at Tesla failure is not just a calculated risk but also - by design - an opportunity to learn.

Some of Musk's quotes I took from here:

You should take the approach that you’re wrong. Your goal is to be less wrong.

A well thought out critique of whatever you’re doing is as valuable as gold. You should seek that from everyone you can but particularly your friends. Usually, your friends know what’s wrong, but they don’t want to tell you because they don’t want to hurt you. [Even if you don’t agree with their feedback,] You at least want to listen very carefully to what they say.

Failure is an option here. If things are not failing, you are not innovating enough.

When you try new things you could fail or strike gold. If you fail and understand why you failed you are better prepared for the next try. But you have to learn.
Doing things just like you're told to do teaches you nothing.

This approach has worked for all the companies Musk has been involved in: Zip2, X.com, SpaceX and Tesla.
No doubt it will work for the Boring Company too, but as they only started at the end of 2016 they haven't had time enough to accumulate a decent set of failures yet.

[redpoint5]

Originally Posted by Xist

He says you get a side job, save up $20,000, buy a cosmetic fixer-upper for below market value, fix it up, and live in it [instead of renting]. The next year you save another $20,000, buy another cosmetic fixer-upper for below market value, fix it up, and rent it out. He says that you save up $20,000 and buy a house to rent out every year.

He previously said to put 3.5% down. It may not flow cash, but it will once you pay off the mortgage insurance? He has a video saying that if you break even, but build equity, you come out ahead.

This much detail requires more organization to be easily readable/understandable.

Anyhow, the equity you build is extremely small at first based on how interest rates work. The first year 85% of your payment goes into interest, and only 15% goes towards the principle.


Regarding fixer uppers; profiting from improvements depends on the market value of those improvements vs your investment of time and money. Some improvements can be cash positive, while many are not. If the house had black painted walls, obviously painting then neutral/white would improve the value more than the cost to paint. My kitchen has granite tile, and I don't like tile. If I were to tear it out and put quartz or granite slab in, there's almost no way I'd make the money back in added home value.

The thing about improvements only helping a home sell faster sounds bogus to me. If something becomes more desirable, then by definition it's more valuable. Instead of selling fast, just increase the price and wait a little longer to get it.

This deserves it's own thread...

Originally Posted by RedDevil

A funny thing about Tesla is the mentality behind their innovation drive....

I thought you had gone massively OT after reading Xist's post, then I looked at the thread title.

[freebeard]

Originally Posted by RedDevil

Tesla often tries things that fail at first. It turns out that at Tesla failure is not just a calculated risk but also - by design - an opportunity to learn.

https://duckduckgo.com/?q=fail+early+fail+often

Fail early, fail often, but always fail forward." ― John Maxwell, Failing Forward.

[Xist]

Originally Posted by redpoint5

This much detail requires more organization to be easily readable/understandable.

What do you recommend?

Originally Posted by redpoint5

This deserves it's own thread...

Huh. I should probably improve it first.

Originally Posted by redpoint5

I thought you had gone massively OT after reading Xist's post, then I looked at the thread title.

I once found a national database of home improvements and the best ROI was a modern and attractive steel front door. It had a 99% ROI. It only got worse from there. I could not find that quickly. The first Google result was Zillow, which I did not feel was necessarily a good source. The second was Architecture Digest, which quoted Zillow.

They did a countdown, but I will get to the point:

1. Midrange bathroom remodel. 171%. Let me post pictures of our bathrooms and you will agree.
2. Mid-range window replacement: 115%. While Meet Kevin promotes fixing up homes, he says that many people overimprove and never recover their money. He specifically says that if the windows work, they are good enough.
3. Family room addition: 107%. Would I get out of redoing the window trim?
4. Story addition: 102%. This may cost $50,000, but you will probably break even.

https://www.architecturaldigest.com/story/home-improvement-projects-ranked-return-on-investment

I like the bathroom remodel, but spend money so that Mom needs to pay more real estate tax [only if we have the house assessed]?

By the way, I just noticed the fast-forward icon next to the "[quote]" part. Nice!

[RedDevil]

Originally Posted by freebeard

https://duckduckgo.com/?q=fail+early+fail+often

It is not just about failing, at least not about the result part of failing.
It is about not assuming you're right at whatever you do by default. "You should take the approach that you’re wrong. Your goal is to be less wrong."

You must be open minded and willing to accept that you can be wrong.
Criticism and advice from friends and failure to achieve something will point out where you're wrong, where you can improve the situation - if you are willing to take it in.
It is bloody essential, there's no substitute.

I'm fully aware that I may be wrong though

[freebeard]

I once found a national database of home improvements and the best ROI was a modern and attractive steel front door. It had a 99% ROI. It only got worse from there...

99% is the only underwater % listed. National Backwards Day was yesterday.

One feature in the [retirement] house I designed for my parents was the ability to surveill the outside of the entry door from inside the house. Surprisngly rare.

[QUOTE]
By the way, I just noticed the fast-forward icon next to the "

" part. Nice!

[citation needed]

[Hersbird]

The return on improvements assumes hiring someone to do all the work. I could pay $12,000 to completely remodel my bathroom hoping to get $10,000 more on a sale or just provide a quicker sale, or spend $3000 in materials and do it myself and still get that same return or close to it depending on my skills.

On a rental my "slumlord" buddy says it's never worth it to remodel anything, just fix the broken. Maybe get $50/ month more for a $12,000 bathroom remodel so it takes 20 years to break even and at that point the bathroom needs remodeling again. He bought 10 properties in this town for under $20,000 each 25 years ago, did just enough to make them rentable and they currently all go for over $1000/mo each now and have had constant occupancy. His job after 4 years in the air force was flipping garage sales. He would literally buy out entire sales toward the end of the day and then repackage, price, and relist them for much more. Along with flipping insurance totaled cars. He also worked with me at the Post Office just long enough (about 6 more years) to vest a retirement when he does reach 62 although it will only be 10% it will have other benefits too.

Of course each of those properties would cost $250,000 each to buy today if not more. He "retired" (he manages properties and still does garage sales)at 35 fifteen years ago.

[Xist]

Originally Posted by freebeard

99% is the only underwater % listed.

How many statistics do you remember from random articles that you read years ago?

The steel door had the best ROI. Everything was less than 99%.

Quote:


Hersbird, thanks for pointing out the labor factor. The first two times that one of my cars needed a new timing belt I paid $1,000 each, but I did it myself with the Accord, replaced the other belts, hoses, and everything else that people suggested, and paid something like $250 - $300.

"Yeah, but if you figure out all of the time that it took, if you just spent that same time working at McDonald's..."

At $10 an hour I would have needed to work 65 - 70 hours to pay a mechanic to do less work than I did. I am a terrible repairman, but it took me way less than that.

The other argument is that my time is worth more than $10 an hour. I earn far more than that, but have far fewer clients than I want. I do not have any idea why they have not found me clients even though I keep asking. We got a new occupational therapist up here a few months back and she still only has three clients. She probably wants ten or twenty.

I have plenty of time to work on things. Buying the necessary tools is almost cheaper than paying a professional.

[freebeard]

171%.-115%.-107%.-102%.

Temporary crano-rectal inversion.

The return on improvements assumes hiring someone to do all the work.

On a rental my "slumlord" buddy says it's never worth it to remodel anything, just fix the broken... He bought 10 properties in this town for under $20,000 each 25 years ago, did just enough to make them rentable and they currently all go for over $1000/mo each now and have had constant occupancy.

$120K/year but he's den mother to 10 posses of who-know-what going on. My slumlord has 60+ units, and I suspect my neighbor (30days notice, not budging) is blackmailing/threatening him.

My little brother tried rental properties. He had to drive from Beaverton to Oregon City to replace water heaters, and &. Eventually he got out from under it all, but he had to sell his 1940 Ford panel truck to afford a sailboat to make his escape. I'd have just driven the truck but he wanted to live in a hole in the water.