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Old 11-19-2018, 05:18 PM   #751 (permalink)
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So, why can't we roll up to a charging center, have a robot swap batteries, and roll out, again?

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Old 11-19-2018, 05:52 PM   #752 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xist View Post
So, why can't we roll up to a charging center, have a robot swap batteries, and roll out, again?
Because that is still extremely slow.

Batteries are often stressed members of the chassis

You don't want someone's abused battery

Best designs use a liquid heating/cooling loop for the battery - loss of coolant each swap - bleed the system - slow
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Old 11-19-2018, 06:17 PM   #753 (permalink)
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So when Musk shows up at LeMans with an S and an 18 wheeler full of batteries, I'm guessing that won't be fair either.
How I'd like to see Musk pull up at the 24 Hours of LeMons and enter something with a T badge that does meet the criteria...
Really! It would be a giant leap for mankind.
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Old 11-19-2018, 06:43 PM   #754 (permalink)
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Quote:
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So, why can't we roll up to a charging center, have a robot swap batteries, and roll out, again?
Swapping batteries would require all manufacturers to agree on a common battery. That would then freeze battery development in time. This would be a step backward not forward.

As someone that drives an EV almost every day - our current charging methods are not a problem. I don't want to drive somewhere to swap batteries. I don't want to drive somewhere to charge. I charge at home while I sleep or at work while I'm working.
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Old 11-19-2018, 07:23 PM   #755 (permalink)
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I don't see EV's being good long distance until both the batteries and the charging infrastructure are capable of delivering astounding amounts of power in a short period of time, like half a million watts kind of astounding (10x faster than current).

It would be cool to see batteries adopt some sort of modular formfactor where the chemistry and quantity can change, but it all slots into standard "bays", but that's far off, if ever. Just look how they can't standardize on common parts like steering wheels, brakes, etc, etc.
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Old 11-19-2018, 08:09 PM   #756 (permalink)
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It’s almost guaranteed they won’t standardize most parts because everybody has opinions of what is “best” for their purpose... I do think that they should standardize at least the charge plug so that nationwide infrastructure can be put in place for fast charging EVs...

As it is now the only pure EV that I would seriously consider as my primary car is a Tesla, for just the supercharger network ALONE...

I’d love a Chevy Bolt but from what I understand the lack of infrastructure means I’m leashed to my home by half it’s range... sometimes I drive more than 300mi in a day and buying gasoline is a 15 min stop...
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Old 11-19-2018, 09:38 PM   #757 (permalink)
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Even if just Teslas swapped batteries amongst themselves. You purchase a Tesla and you have free battery swaps until you hit 150,000 miles. They recondition batteries that do not receive a charge properly.

It would defeat the purpose of LeMans to bring multiple vehicles, right? Would five be enough?
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Old 11-19-2018, 09:47 PM   #758 (permalink)
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Quote:
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Even if just Teslas swapped batteries amongst themselves. You purchase a Tesla and you have free battery swaps until you hit 150,000 miles. They recondition batteries that do not receive a charge properly.

It would defeat the purpose of LeMans to bring multiple vehicles, right? Would five be enough?
You're missing the point that nobody wants a degraded battery, even if it meets minimum specifications. Why get stuck with a battery that has a 250 mile range when your original battery had a 300 mile range?

It's like swapping engines in a car. You wouldn't be cool with an engine that meets spec, but is 5 HP down on power and uses a little oil when yours didn't.

The active cooling, electrical connections, and mounting is complicated enough that swapping within the same model type is no easy task.

That said, if Tesla had some way to supercharge a battery off-vehicle, and could somehow swap batteries quickly, you could probably almost get by with a single spare battery that charges while the car uses the other one.
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Old 11-19-2018, 10:48 PM   #759 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 19bonestock88 View Post
It’s almost guaranteed they won’t standardize most parts because everybody has opinions of what is “best” for their purpose... I do think that they should standardize at least the charge plug so that nationwide infrastructure can be put in place for fast charging EVs...

As it is now the only pure EV that I would seriously consider as my primary car is a Tesla, for just the supercharger network ALONE...

I’d love a Chevy Bolt but from what I understand the lack of infrastructure means I’m leashed to my home by half it’s range... sometimes I drive more than 300mi in a day and buying gasoline is a 15 min stop...
We do have a standardized plug in the USA. It is SAE J1772 for Level 2 charging and CCS Type 1 for fast charging. The problem is that Tesla and Japanese manufacturers refuse to use the standardized plug.

The current count in the USA are as follows:
2473 CCS DC chargers (US and EU manufacturers)
4120 CHAdeMO DC chargers (Japanese manufacturers)
7434 Tesla Superchargers (Tesla only)

VW will be adding 2000 CCS chargers by the end of 2019 as part of the dieselgate settlement. CCS seems to be the plug of choice for independent charger companies as well though some are building out stations with dual plugs.

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I don't see EV's being good long distance until both the batteries and the charging infrastructure are capable of delivering astounding amounts of power in a short period of time, like half a million watts kind of astounding (10x faster than current).
The reality of the huge amounts of electricity needed for fast charging pokes a huge hole in the idea of Tesla Semis doing long haul routes and fast charging along the way. Adding 400 miles of range to one Tesla Semi in 30 minutes requires the same amount of electricity as 7000 houses.

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Old 11-19-2018, 11:57 PM   #760 (permalink)
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Yeah, I don't think Tesla semis will be used for long haul. Probably better used to move product from distribution centers to stores relatively short distances. They'd need to be able to charge up at the loading docks while being loaded/unloaded.

I'm curious how the Tesla semis will pencil out, and to see if they become commonplace. They'd sure be great in city gridlock, both in terms of recapturing braking energy, and in being capable of accelerating back up to speed.

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