Tesla Model 3

[aerohead]

Originally Posted by Xist

Hopefully most Tesla repairs could be performed on-site.

There were car salesmen in Afghanistan. I know a couple of Soldiers that bought cars, presumably sight-unseen.

A friend has a friend in the Air Force who's just done it.She's ecstatic about the car.

[aerohead]

Originally Posted by JSH

Maybe the shell of the building

Looks like they have expectations of production by end of December.

[aerohead]

Originally Posted by JSH

My point is that Tesla owners love the Tesla method because the cost is covered under warranty. They might not be so pleased when they have to pay out of pocket and they don't get a free loaner.

Tesla's method works when because they are small company selling expensive cars. I doubt it will work so well when they have millions of cars in the field.

The only Tesla service center in the state of Oregon is located in Portland. How much do you think it costs just for transport to service a car in Bend?

If the major automakers will mass-produce like vehicles,at similar price,service them locally, providing nationwide charging infrastructure,and run Elon Musk out business,he'll die a happy man!

[SPGroup]

I love Tesla. It's just too expensive. I ended up buying a Nissan Leaf which does the job.

[thingstodo]

Originally Posted by redpoint5

I just don't see an EV failing to operate under its own power unless it was involved in a wreck or some other unlikely failure.

I have 4 Sevcon AC Controllers that have various faults on them, and would not drive their respective vehicles (Polaris Ranger EVs).

Separately, the BMS failed (cabling, connector and temperature sensor respectively) on 3 of these same Ranger EVs and would not allow the vehicles to run (after the controller problems were dealt with).

And I have had an ignition switch intermittent failure stop on of these Polaris Rangers from running, making my wife very cross at the walk home.

I have no stats on how likely these failures are compared to the other things that fail. But EVs have reliability problems, just like ICE cars. An ECU is not as complex as an AC controller, a BMS is not the same as an ABS controller ... but where there are electronics and sensors, stuff happens

The OEMs appear to be quite paranoid about the BMS link to the AC Controller. And it is important to adjust charging when batteries are too cold, or too hot. There are several sections of the Polaris Service manual that start with 'Vehicle will not run' or 'Vehicle will not power up'.

[redpoint5]

I didn't say EVs would not fail, I said they are unlikely to fail.

Comparing the reliability of modern passenger EVs to an ATV is a mistake.

It's too soon to say how reliable they will be since the oldest ones are only 8 years old, but so far they have shown to be very dependable. Batteries tend to degrade over time rather than catastrophically die. It's almost unheard of with other components failing. I've heard of a handful of motors getting replaced by Tesla.

Seems to be a difference in my outlook on life compared to many others. I generally plan for success, not for failure. I'm willing to risk more to gain more. What I mean is, I'd rather bank on the reliability of EVs at the risk of having to get one towed 100 miles if there were problems than to own a vehicle I know will need much work but only need a 15 mile tow.

... and at some point I expect 3rd party EV repair shops to pop up. They'll never be as prevalent as regular auto shops because we're near peak automobile, and EVs will have much fewer problems requiring much less work to resolve.

[thingstodo]

Originally Posted by redpoint5

I didn't say EVs would not fail, I said they are unlikely to fail.

I would word it 'less likely', but I generally agree. I purchased the ATV's as surplus ... some of my issues were certainly expected.

Comparing the reliability of modern passenger EVs to an ATV is a mistake.

I hadn't really thought about it that way. I guess the engineering time can't be invested when the unit sales are 1/10 or 1/100 (maybe 1/1000) of passenger vehicles. Good point.

It's too soon to say how reliable they will be since the oldest ones are only 8 years old, but so far they have shown to be very dependable. Batteries tend to degrade over time rather than catastrophically die. It's almost unheard of with other components failing. I've heard of a handful of motors getting replaced by Tesla.

Agreed

Seems to be a difference in my outlook on life compared to many others. I generally plan for success, not for failure.

I hope for success, but plan alternates and backup plans at every juncture I can .. it takes effort and time.

I'm willing to risk more to gain more. What I mean is, I'd rather bank on the reliability of EVs at the risk of having to get one towed 100 miles if there were problems than to own a vehicle I know will need much work but only need a 15 mile tow.

Yup. I agree with that. I might even buy something that I expect to have to fix myself. As long as my wife does not need to drive it!

... and at some point I expect 3rd party EV repair shops to pop up. They'll never be as prevalent as regular auto shops because we're near peak automobile, and EVs will have much fewer problems requiring much less work to resolve.

Yup.

I really need to review my posts before I hit send. In retrospect I often appear all-too-argumentative.

I agree with most of the content posted ... but go way over-board trying to make a point. Silly, really!

It's a good thing that others, like you, have the etiquette ... or perhaps the patience? .. to respond to such posts in a reasonable manner.

[oldtamiyaphile]

Originally Posted by thingstodo

Agreed that there is no LEAD. And less CO2. And .. and .. and ...

Lead is a big problem in coal mining towns, so in fact a portion of EV's are running on leaded fuel when ICE's haven't for decades.

Less Co2 is of course not clear cut either (and that's using well to wheels).

[JSH]

Originally Posted by aerohead

Looks like they have expectations of production by end of December.

Musk has never hit a production date.

I expect that he will have some people hand assembly some cars and claim the factory is operational.

Originally Posted by redpoint5

... and at some point I expect 3rd party EV repair shops to pop up. They'll never be as prevalent as regular auto shops because we're near peak automobile, and EVs will have much fewer problems requiring much less work to resolve.

That is hard to do when Tesla won't sell parts to independent repair shops or body shops.

[Xist]

Has someone already shared the YouTube video of the guy who repairs his own Tesla? He bought three $70 parts from someone in a forum in order to fix his door handle when Tesla wanted $1,000 for the assembly.

I think my door handle was $10...

Shouty complains about plastic door handles even on luxury cars. Do you really want metal door handles in the summer?

As long as service centers keep up with sales, that should be adequate. According to this, Tesla sold 452,833 cars between 3rd quarter 2015 to 4th quarter 2018, so if they have 4.4 times as many service centers by the time they sell their two-millionth car, why wouldn't that be adequate?