Go Back   EcoModder Forum > EcoModding > Fossil Fuel Free
Register Now
 Register Now
 

Reply  Post New Thread
 
Submit Tools LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 03-03-2019, 01:51 AM   #941 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
freebeard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: northwest of normal
Posts: 14,131
Thanks: 3,476
Thanked 4,644 Times in 3,703 Posts
The semi will obviously require a bigger assembly line. The rule-of-thumb in 1950s Detroit was they only needed to change 10% of parts for the new models. And it's really all about the tools that make the tools.

__________________
.
God's blessing on this wonderful world!
_________________
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to freebeard For This Useful Post:
aerohead (03-06-2019)
Alt Today
Popular topics

Other popular topics in this forum...

   
Old 03-03-2019, 06:21 AM   #942 (permalink)
Duck duck duck
 
RedDevil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Nieuwegein, the Netherlands
Posts: 3,481

Red Devil - '11 Honda Insight Elegance
Team Honda
90 day: 55.76 mpg (US)

It - '09 Hyundai I10 Active Cool
Team Hyundai
90 day: 31.18 mpg (US)
Thanks: 1,334
Thanked 1,847 Times in 1,186 Posts
A snapshot from the past: https://phys.org/news/2015-01-tesla-...r-company.html
Quote:
CEO Elon Musk ... said Tesla needs to show a profit, and will when it's selling 500,000 cars per year. He predicted that sales milestone will be reached in 2020, when its lower-cost car—the Model 3—is in full production.
That does not seem overly ambitious now.
__________________
2011 Honda Insight + HID, LEDs, tiny PV panel, extra brake pad return springs, neutral wheel alignment, 44/42 PSI (air), PHEV light (inop), tightened wheel nut.
lifetime FE over 0.14 Gm or 0.09 MM.

  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to RedDevil For This Useful Post:
aerohead (03-06-2019)
Old 03-03-2019, 10:54 AM   #943 (permalink)
wdb
lurker's apprentice
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: the Perimeter
Posts: 826

PlainJane - '12 Toyota Tacoma Base 4WD Access Cab
90 day: 20.98 mpg (US)
Thanks: 377
Thanked 179 Times in 138 Posts
I'm seeing Model 3's pretty regularly around here now. The store closure thing has me curious though; where would I go for warranty service and other work? The nearest "service center" to me is a bit over an hour away, and it is listed as a "store and service center". Is it closing?

And there's no way in the world I would ever buy something that costs that much money without laying hands on it first. I get that there's a cult that doesn't care, but I do. I suppose I could waylay a stranger and ask them to let me crawl over their car and take it for a test drive, but that might or might not go well.

I also looked for charging locations while I was checking their maps. Although I live on the periphery of the east coast megalopolis, my area is very ill served by charging stations. I understand Tesla is putting these stations up themselves, trying to solve the chicken/egg dilemma, and I think that's great. But unless I'm using it to commute into the maelstrom, a Tesla is not a practical vehicle for me at this time. In other words it would have to be a commuter vehicle, covering part of my needs. Even at $35K that does not seem economically sensible; my last commuting-centric purchase was a Honda Fit for $15K.

I continue to watch with interest. And the garage we're building will have 100A service.
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to wdb For This Useful Post:
aerohead (03-06-2019)
Old 03-03-2019, 11:33 AM   #944 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
sendler's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Syracuse, NY USA
Posts: 2,935

Honda CBR250R FI Single - '11 Honda CBR250R
90 day: 105.14 mpg (US)

2001 Honda Insight stick - '01 Honda Insight manual
90 day: 60.68 mpg (US)

2009 Honda Fit auto - '09 Honda Fit Auto
90 day: 38.51 mpg (US)

PCX153 - '13 Honda PCX150
90 day: 104.48 mpg (US)

2015 Yamaha R3 - '15 Yamaha R3
90 day: 80.94 mpg (US)

Ninja650 - '19 Kawasaki Ninja 650
90 day: 72.57 mpg (US)
Thanks: 326
Thanked 1,311 Times in 965 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by wdb View Post
where would I go for warranty service and other work? The nearest "service center" to me is a bit over an hour away, and it is listed as a "store and service center". Is it closing?
They have never had a real viable plan for service. Tesla is banking on the cars not needing much. For the most part now, they send a tech to do the work in your parking lot if possible for warranty work. If needed they bring a loaner car on a flatbed and tow your car back to the service center.
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to sendler For This Useful Post:
aerohead (03-06-2019)
Old 03-03-2019, 12:08 PM   #945 (permalink)
EcoModding Newb
 
redpoint5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Oregon
Posts: 6,706

Acura TSX - '06 Acura TSX
90 day: 28.07 mpg (US)

Lafawnda - '01 Honda CBR600 F4i
90 day: 47.32 mpg (US)

Big Yeller - '98 Dodge Ram 2500 base
90 day: 21.82 mpg (US)

Prius Plug-in - '12 Toyota Prius Plug-in
90 day: 57.64 mpg (US)

Mazda CX-5 - '17 Mazda CX-5 Touring
90 day: 28.08 mpg (US)
Thanks: 2,194
Thanked 2,549 Times in 1,883 Posts
I certainly understand the argument that one would not buy a car without being able to see/drive one first at a showroom, but I don't think younger generations have such reservations.

The first vehicle I ever purchased was the 2001 CBR in my avatar. I bid $5,500 for it on an Ebay auction in 2003 without being able to see the bike in person. My truck was bought at Ebay too, but I was able to see the truck beforehand since the DOT is nearby.

Things are increasingly going towards internet sales. Most of my clothing I buy online even though fit is so important. I'll either take a gamble that sizes are as listed, or I know that particular brand.

My guess is people will drive a friend's car and that will give them the confidence to purchase online.

Tesla has mobile repair, which probably makes more sense than a higher density of service centers, considering most things that will fail on a Tesla would be things like door handles, and other smaller components. Motors and batteries really shouldn't be failing.
__________________
Gas and Electric Vehicle Cost of Ownership Calculator







Give me absolute safety, or give me death!
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to redpoint5 For This Useful Post:
aerohead (03-06-2019)
Old 03-04-2019, 12:17 AM   #946 (permalink)
JSH
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: PDX
Posts: 836

Adventure Seeker - '04 Chevy Astro - Campervan
90 day: 17.3 mpg (US)

Dieselgate - '14 VW Jetta Sportwagen TDI
90 day: 38.24 mpg (US)
Thanks: 17
Thanked 374 Times in 270 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by roflwaffle View Post
It'll be expensive, but I don't think it has to break the bank. A quick search suggests the Y will be between $200 million and $600 million for tooling. Apparently lower volume tooling can also be less expensive with the trade-off of being less durable, but I couldn't find anything on how much less.
The last CUV mid-cycle refresh I was involved in cost $600 million. That was a new front clip, some small changes to the rear, and a mild restyling of the interior that kept the same mechanics and structure.

Musk has announce the Y will be made at the gigafactory which doesn't build the Model 3 today. That means a whole new assembly line


Quote:
Originally Posted by roflwaffle View Post
All things considered, I'm not sure how much the lines and tooling for the Y, Roadster, and Semi will cost, but Tesla has experience being involved in construction and can do at least some stuff in house. For instance one of their first acquisitions they made was a tool-and-die maker, so I wouldn't be surprised if they have some advantages in tooling costs.
It costs more than $1 billion to tool a new semi. You need all of the part tooling plus a new cab-in-white, dash line, and chassis line. Telsa may need new paint line too, it just depends on if the original line was built to accommodate the size and with enough extra capacity.

Most companies I worked for that have internal tool-and die use them for tooling repair and maintenance. When a tool breaks you need it fixed ASAP and with an internal shop you can prioritize jobs as needed. Some have done new tooling in-house to but the cost was very close to outside bids.
  Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to JSH For This Useful Post:
aerohead (03-06-2019), Xist (03-04-2019)
Old 03-05-2019, 12:06 PM   #947 (permalink)
JSH
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: PDX
Posts: 836

Adventure Seeker - '04 Chevy Astro - Campervan
90 day: 17.3 mpg (US)

Dieselgate - '14 VW Jetta Sportwagen TDI
90 day: 38.24 mpg (US)
Thanks: 17
Thanked 374 Times in 270 Posts
China has put a stop sale order on the Model 3 due to some issues found during customs inspection.

https://electrek.co/2019/03/05/tesla...-halted-china/
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to JSH For This Useful Post:
aerohead (03-06-2019)
Old 03-05-2019, 12:09 PM   #948 (permalink)
Duck duck duck
 
RedDevil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Nieuwegein, the Netherlands
Posts: 3,481

Red Devil - '11 Honda Insight Elegance
Team Honda
90 day: 55.76 mpg (US)

It - '09 Hyundai I10 Active Cool
Team Hyundai
90 day: 31.18 mpg (US)
Thanks: 1,334
Thanked 1,847 Times in 1,186 Posts
Apparently some decals or labels that should have been in the Chinese language were English.
Makes me wonder how that's been done with the Model X and S- es that have been imported in China for quite some time now.

Edit: Yup, missing and incorrect labels on the brake fluid tanks of some cars.
https://www.teslarati.com/tesla-mode...ocked-customs/

And they are already released, problem solved.
__________________
2011 Honda Insight + HID, LEDs, tiny PV panel, extra brake pad return springs, neutral wheel alignment, 44/42 PSI (air), PHEV light (inop), tightened wheel nut.
lifetime FE over 0.14 Gm or 0.09 MM.


Last edited by RedDevil; 03-05-2019 at 02:41 PM..
  Reply With Quote
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to RedDevil For This Useful Post:
aerohead (03-06-2019), ldjessee00 (03-05-2019), samwichse (03-06-2019), Xist (03-05-2019)
Old 03-05-2019, 02:04 PM   #949 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
NeilBlanchard's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Maynard, MA Eaarth
Posts: 7,709

Mica Blue - '05 Scion xA RS 2.0
Team Toyota
90 day: 42.48 mpg (US)

Forest - '15 Nissan Leaf S
Team Nissan
90 day: 156.46 mpg (US)

Number 7 - '15 VW e-Golf SEL
TEAM VW AUDI Group
90 day: 155.81 mpg (US)
Thanks: 3,161
Thanked 2,736 Times in 1,709 Posts
Model Y reveal is set for next Thursday, March 14th.
__________________
Sincerely, Neil

http://neilblanchard.blogspot.com/
  Reply With Quote
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to NeilBlanchard For This Useful Post:
aerohead (03-06-2019), ldjessee00 (03-05-2019), redpoint5 (03-05-2019), Xist (03-05-2019)
Old 03-06-2019, 04:50 AM   #950 (permalink)
Duck duck duck
 
RedDevil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Nieuwegein, the Netherlands
Posts: 3,481

Red Devil - '11 Honda Insight Elegance
Team Honda
90 day: 55.76 mpg (US)

It - '09 Hyundai I10 Active Cool
Team Hyundai
90 day: 31.18 mpg (US)
Thanks: 1,334
Thanked 1,847 Times in 1,186 Posts
Saw my first Model 3 in the wild this morning.
Matte orange (!) probably a wrap.

__________________
2011 Honda Insight + HID, LEDs, tiny PV panel, extra brake pad return springs, neutral wheel alignment, 44/42 PSI (air), PHEV light (inop), tightened wheel nut.
lifetime FE over 0.14 Gm or 0.09 MM.

  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to RedDevil For This Useful Post:
aerohead (03-06-2019)
Reply  Post New Thread


Thread Tools




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.5.2
All content copyright EcoModder.com