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Old 04-09-2008, 10:49 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Volt rant

With some sharp surfaces on the otherwise more bulbous than necessary nose, angular and exposed wheel spokes, etc., that Volt is far from an optimimal aerodynamic shape.

Rather, it's an attempt to moderate some of the design vulgarity put there by the same Detroit mentality that produced the Cadillac Escalade and Ford Exhibition. In other words, it's ugly.

Drag coefficients in the 0.13 range were achieved in wind tunnel tests in Germany in the mid-1930s, per Dr. S. Hoerner's "Fluid Dynamic Drag," page 12-3 and 12-4. Buckminster Fuller's Dymaxion car also had pretty low drag, also decades ago.

The Oscar Meyer Weinermobile, for that matter, has lower drag than a lot of stuff coming out of Detroit, which seems to have a serious learning disability.

Sorry about the rant.

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Old 04-13-2008, 06:02 AM   #12 (permalink)
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40 mile range? sorry, but thats sorta useless..

function vs cost.

unless were talking a hybrid version. then maybe we got something..
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Old 04-13-2008, 12:12 PM   #13 (permalink)
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It's a hybrid. 40 miles electric is GM's claimed target range, plus a small onboard combustion engine for longer distances.
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Old 04-13-2008, 04:36 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Re the Prius "being the one to beat"...the Prius sure isn't my standard.

Sure, the Cd (of .26) sounds good. But, as you know, what counts is CdA. Wonder why you never hear what the Prius CdA is? Here's why: with a frontal area of 27.68 sqft the CdA is around 6 sqft! If you use an 84% factor on the LxW numbers, you get a CdA of 6.05; if you use 80% (which I really think is too low based on how boxy it is) you get 5.76 sq ft.

Compare that to the Honda Insight with a nearly identical Cd of .25 but with a CdA of 5.13 sq ft. Its frontal area (LxW) is 24.7 sq ft compared with the Prius's 27.7! (Note that the 5.13 CdA means that the true frontal area of the Insight is 83% of the LxW number which is one reason I think the .8 is probably too low).

And fer chrissakes--GM has the EV1 to build on and it had a CdA of about 4 sq ft. With a running start like that, there's no earthly reason for the Volt to be where it is.

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Old 04-13-2008, 06:09 PM   #15 (permalink)
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I agree that Cd shouldn't be the only focus for Detroit. That car looks like a Caddy: huge.

I think the Volt will be successful only in the sense that it will change American perceptions of "going green." Instead of being the realm of hippies, "going green" will be an area that maintains the status quo without requiring large lifestyle changes.

I think the American masses ultimately care about their wallet. Sure, they are willing to change their lifestyle slightly to help the environment, but few will commit to major lifestyle changes. The Volt will allow them to live a familiar lifestyle for a little while longer in the twilight of oil and the great American economy. The pocketbook...that's where it'll succeed.

I don't blame Detroit, though. You can only sell what people want. I suppose I blame their advertising departments, though...

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Old 04-13-2008, 07:55 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LostCause View Post
I think the Volt will be successful only in the sense that it will change American perceptions of "going green." Instead of being the realm of hippies, "going green" will be an area that maintains the status quo without requiring large lifestyle changes.
<snip>
I don't blame Detroit, though. You can only sell what people want. I suppose I blame their advertising departments, though...

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Here in the SF Bay Area, the Prius is very popular--it seems to be doing a pretty good job of changing perceptions about going green (not that it couldn't be a greener car). But then, I live in the land of hippies Whether GM makes (and markets decently) anything that rivals it is an open question in my mind--it would be great if they did, but I'm just not holding my breath. Between Toyota and Honda, I think GM will find it very hard to compete.

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Old 04-13-2008, 08:03 PM   #17 (permalink)
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but alot of people wont buy a prius because its a tiny car, not enough leg room
and not exactly family vacation friendly not to mention its a goofy looking car..

to me they look a whole lot like a Corolla/Nova or cititation from the 80's, just modernized.. It's just my opinion, but I appreciate them for what they are..

If they make hybrinds more appealing, more people will buy
them and I think Chevy has something that has potential..

but with that VOLT's style, I bet you'll see 24 and 26" rims on those in no time
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Old 04-13-2008, 09:06 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris D. View Post
but alot of people wont buy a prius because its a tiny car, not enough leg room
and not exactly family vacation friendly not to mention its a goofy looking car..

to me they look a whole lot like a Corolla/Nova or cititation from the 80's, just modernized.. It's just my opinion, but I appreciate them for what they are..

If they make hybrinds more appealing, more people will buy
them and I think Chevy has something that has potential..

but with that VOLT's style, I bet you'll see 24 and 26" rims on those in no time
I hear that all the time from folks who have never been in one. Tiny compared to what? You can easily put four people and bags and travel anywhere at 55+ MPG.

http://autos.yahoo.com/toyota_prius_...k-specs/?p=int
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Old 04-13-2008, 09:11 PM   #19 (permalink)
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I had one as a rental car.. its definatly not designed for tall or large people..

can you get a prius in anything else other than an automatic?
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Old 04-13-2008, 09:15 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris D. View Post
I had one as a rental car.. its definatly not designed for tall or large people..

can you get a prius in anything else other than an automatic?
Nope

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