The climate change consensus extends beyond climate scientists

[oil pan 4]

Originally Posted by aerohead

Cosmic rays are a misnomer.They're cosmic particles.

Yes nuclei up to the size of iron usually and traveling some where around 99% the speed of light.
To compare the suns particles normally move at around 1 to 2 million miles per hour and up to 7 million miles per hour during big solar storms.

[aerohead]

Originally Posted by NeilBlanchard

Huh? All the data is public.

I'm not current,but in the recent past,the fossil fuel *****s wanted to get the raw data from researchers,so they could re-interpret it in an effort to forestall any regulations predicated on the original conclusions.
I read a whole book on it.
'DOUBT IS THEIR PRODUCT',by David Michaels,Oxford University Press,2008
www.DefendingScience.org
There's been a complete,top-down,Republican Party attempt to destroy science.
NATURE Magazine has had some articles about federal government attempts to mess with scientists,and the scientists sued the *******s,and at the time,refused to grant access to their data,because they knew exactly what the corporate-***** 'scientists' were going to do with it,which was straight out of the Phillip Morris Tobacco Company disinformation playbook.
Liquid evil.

[freebeard]

originally posted by aerohead

Don't fret. Understanding eludes you, yet you instinctively spell aerohead with a lower case a. All is well.

What is the obvious answer to dark matter? I've not even heard of a guess as to what it is besides possible unaccounted for matter that doesn't interact in our universe except gravitationally.

What it is, is wrong. Miss-aprehension of an Electric Universe, based on assumptions about red shift and the mechanics of galactic rotation.

[redpoint5]

Originally Posted by aerohead

A couple of road warriors with CAR and DRIVER drove a Tesla Model S P85,from Ann Arbor,Michigan,to New York,then to Los Angeles,and I think their only complaint,was the choice of restaurants near the Supercharger stations.

My only complaint would be the comfort of the hotel pillows and quality of my expensed meals, too, if I were being paid to drive coast to coast at a snails pace. Not my definition of road warrior.

My point is that while a few might want to stop for an hour every 3 hours and eat a sit down meal, many of us don't want to spend more time than absolutely necessary in towns like Salinas or Compton. Instead, we just want to get where we're going.

People that complain about what restaurants are available near superchargers are snobs. That's all there is to it. They could have packed a lunch if they are that picky.

[aerohead]

Originally Posted by oil pan 4

So the complete computer model program where they like to show the polar ice caps melting and everyone dieing this century is available to the public?
Because I know a mechanical engineer who specializes in computer modeling who really wants to see one of these models.
He has been trying to get a hold of one for a few years now.

Yes,I think.
One of the poor ---stards working with them actually sent out an open letter to everyone on earth with a PC, around 1999,asking them to volunteer their desktops,to run the program,as individuals were already doing for SETI.
The program was from the Hadley Center,UK.One iteration took 6-months.With millions of PCs running it,they'd have enough ouput to better predict with.
I've got an old website for that,but Copy Pro is closing for a 4-day T-day holiday,and it'll be the following weekend before I can have that to share.
Bush-Cheney (Arbusto Oil,Halliburton)and their lackeys did all they could to kill climate science.

[aerohead]

Originally Posted by sendler

I'm not recommending further fossil fuel use. Since it is not even a possible choice to just leave it in the ground. What I am trying to say is that we are completely dependant on it. And the impending diminished access to oil and other crucial depleted resources will bring a societal collapse. Before any comparably destructive effects of climate change manifest. This is totally unbeknownst to most people. Climate change has totally distracted the conversation and planning away from addressing the complete social reordering that is headed for us as primary energy slips forever away to a lower level.

As they say,'The exception proves the rule.'
From where I'm standing,I see plenty of off-the-shelf technology which can supplant a lot of what is presently being accomplished with internal combustion and fossil fuel.
And sure,things don't happen overnight.
Societal collapse scares 1-percenters,they'll do whatever they can to prevent anarchy and chaos.This is something Thomas Malthus addressed explicitly,even if it takes a Hitler or Mussolini.We'll have a 100% bonafide police state before we have anarchy.And the US military will fire upon the general population if it has to.They've already done it.
I really do believe that there will be a slow,incremental,orderly transition to whatever new paradigm those in a position of authority select.
The alternative will be too horrible to contemplate.

[aerohead]

Originally Posted by oil pan 4

Oh so they can't release the source data to protect everyone from the opposing view.
I see how it is. One sided, don't ask, don't tell science, secret if any peer review, yeah seems legit.
I will wait for it to come out on wiki leaks.
Getting the impression the believers are terrified of true transparency.
No thata a lie, I have known all along the believers will never go for full transparency, I leaned this back when I was kind of a believer, back around 2005 or 2006.

So the sun does effect the atmosphere but the part that it effects doesn't effect the other parts, ha that's rich. Man the rules keep changing in this game faster than I can keep up with.



Both sides lie.

They could but they wouldn't.
It would be like 500 different building code compliance officers showing up at your place,all with different ideas about how to legally install your PV array.You'd never get anything done.All you'd be doing is arguing.
Which is the whole premise of the fossil-fuel industry's campaign for climate denial.Spend a few million on 'doubt' while you make billions in the meantime.
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The Sun does affect all the atmosphere,but the thermosphere is just atomic hydrogen,which is extremely rarified.It doesn't have enough density to transfer heat by conduction.
It's not much of a thermal black-body.
There's no real convection going on which could mix down upper heat through the mesosphere,into the lower troposphere.
As soon as the Earth rotates away from the sunlight,the thermosphere immediately cools off,unlike the troposphere,where the infrared can't get out like it used to.

[sendler]

Originally Posted by aerohead

As they say,'The exception proves the rule.'
From where I'm standing,I see plenty of off-the-shelf technology which can supplant a lot of what is presently being accomplished with internal combustion and fossil fuel.
And sure,things don't happen overnight.

You are still not grasping the scale of our consumption. The last two decades of wind and solar build out have a production of 1.5% of total primary energy.

[aerohead]

Originally Posted by oil pan 4

Yes nuclei up to the size of iron usually and traveling some where around 99% the speed of light.
Which is nothing compared to the sums particles which normally move at around 1 to 2 million miles per hour and up to 7 million miles per hour during big solar storms.

Yes,exactly.The physicists will just call it 'relativistic velocities'.
There's over 150 different molecules that have been identified rushing around out there.
Yes,the storms are amazing.Some of it will move slower than other parts,the fast material will overtake it,causing shock-waves,reverberations,and even counter-shocks which travel back to the Sun.
Our magnetosphere protects us from most of it.
When it does strike the atmosphere,it generates secondary particles.They've got detectors looking at it all the time.A few times a century,extremely-energetic stuff comes in.
It's cool stuff!

[oil pan 4]

We are getting the extreme cosmic energy stuff now.
We'll not right now but with in the last few months.