Making use of the Wiki for modification / hypermiling info

[saand]

Weather Spotter, good to see you already have scientific data on many mods. I am hoping many people will provide scientific data on a particular mod and an average/range can be given for the particular mod.

looks like we are thinking along the same lines. I had planned to set up "blank" pages for every mod with a template showing suggested sections for people to enter their data in. The blank pages will be linked to by one master page which will list all of the 66 mods (and maybe some unproven mods) I can also leave a "template" wiki page which will be the template which people can copy off if they have a new mod to introduce.

I agree with the concept of a moderator however the power of a wiki is that everyone can edit the wiki and it therefore becomes self moderating in a way. So at this stage there are no groups of users that have different privileges. But if you have the time and see someone putting in something stupid or unproven into a wiki you (or anyone) can change it as you see fit. However if we get into situations where lots of people are making crazy claims and making the wiki unmanageable we can approach the ecomodder site admins to set up moderators. I guess at this stage I personally think we should just see how things go for the moment. But I am only one person in this group (im not a site admin) just another guy so feel free to disagree and approach the ecomodder site admins to see if they can set you up as an admin. Note: I also don’t know if the wiki software has a moderator function, I haven’t yet looked into the documentation in depth.

If the group decides a moderator is a good idea, you have my vote as I don’t have lots of free time anyway.

[Weather Spotter]

I see the power of the group, maybe we can get the admins to only allow people over XX number of posted to help edit the wiki? Say 25. This would drastically reduce the snake oil people and keep the Wiki cleaner.

I just want this Wiki to be a source that is creatable (say, I could quote it in a research paper). To make this happen it needs to be well documented and not full of junk. I do not mind the group editing it, I just think that some guidelines are needed.

Idea: section the 65+ mods into groups based on the amount of testing the proves the results? AKA, grill block is 100% verified, side mirror is 90% .... Over inflating tires is 50%, using synthetic oil is 40%...... snake oil 10% or less.

This would allow MPG mods to be searched by proven effectiveness, a new person could very quickly look over the list and see which ones are proven and which mods vary by vehicle type.


Idea 2: have a bar on the page that warns viewers if there is not much data. Like the ones on Wikipedia " this section needs sources to verify its claim". this would make it easy to see which mods need more testing (give me, and others, some ideas on what to gather more data for).

Thanks for putting some effort into this!
I had seen the wiki but I had not seen that we could add pages, so I like the idea of someone setting it up more, then I will add lots of data!

[saand]

Weather, I like your ideas, it would definitely be a shame if the pages were taken over by non-credible information. Ill certainly be deleting or moving any snake oil type mods people put up.

Tonight I have taken a crash course on wiki page writing and set up the main page which you can find here
Car Modifications Main - EcoModder

I would go for your idea number 2 personally. If I can work out how I will put it in. Takes a bit of reading to work out all the features.

Anyway feel free to have a look and make any modifications you like.

I added the unproven mods section so that some new ideas come into the pages and it gives me a place to put new ideas that nobody has any data on. If I see some snake oil concepts I might make a new section "unscientific ideas" or something to that effect.

If you want to make changes or learn how to make new pages there is a manual at the bottom of the main wiki page (the page linked to by the link in the title bar "wiki")

I am going to start on the template now, see how far I get before I head to bed

[saand]

So after a bit of learning how to write wiki pages I have made up the template and I have entered some data in for one of the mods the "side mirror delete" which is one that I know weather spotter has some data for. I have also done this mod so I put in my "unproven" information as a starter.
I have essentially copied the bulk of the data from the 65+ mod list web page (hope nobody minds) and added a few lines from my own experience.
I already realized we need a difficulty indication in the template so I am sure this will all evolve when more people use the pages.

Weather spotter I leave you to modify this first page (side mirror delete) with your data. It is a little confusing to modify the pages to start with but hopefully with the template I have set up you can modify most things without looking up how to write a wiki page.
There is an example for new lines, different sections, images (note: you need to first upload an image before using it in a page), tables and links.

For anyone new to the wiki's if you find a wiki you want to change you need to log into ecomodder then go to the wiki (only registered users can edit wikis) then when you have navigated to the page at the top there is a tab with the text "edit" press that and you will be taken to the edit page with the source information which you can change as much as you like.
Before submitting a page change press preview first to make sure you have not completely messed things up. Also I kept getting automatically logged out so copy your work before submitting it so you don't loose it.

If you dont know how to do something there is a manual at the bottom of the main wiki page (the page linked to by the link in the title bar "wiki"). This manual is a little difficult to understand. I assume it is written by people that write code so they seem to assume the readers also understand code. So if anyone has questions feel free to PM me or ask questions in this thread.

[Weather Spotter]

I took a look at your template, looks great!

I am in the middle of doing the mirror delete, no data yet. I have done the wheel skits and have data for that.
Take a look at the wheel skirts page, I just finished it when I saw your post. If you like the template better than what I did I can edit it later. I will on vacation for the next few days, so I will likely not have much of an internet connection. I can help out more next week!

Keep up the good work!

[MetroMPG]

I support this!

One of the original goals of the mods and hypermiling tips lists was to continually expand them - both in terms of adding more mods/tips, plus illustrative examples (eg. links to project threads in the forum and other supporting info elsewhere on the web). But the current setup relies on me to update it (and to be honest, I bit off more than I can chew. I've got too many projects!).

Suggestion:

Each of the mods/driving tips in the wiki should have a prominent link back to a dedicated (new) forum thread for discussion. I realize the wiki has "discuss" functionality, but if we separate that from the forum, we'd be undermining it somewhat, and I'd want to avoid that.

Concern:

My only reservation of using the wiki is this kind of scenario: where it gets set up / edited by a few motivated members who eventually lose interest/move on (hey, it's life - that happens). Then it gets vandalized / polluted by misinformed or malicious users (it's life - this will also happen).

Many of the tips / mods are controversial. I can guarantee that people will fail to read the disclaimer (eg: in general, "don't be stupid/unsafe") and take great offense at some of the points. Fuel prices are relatively cheap now, so it won't happen a lot. But when prices and traffic go up again, this will happen.

Not sure what the solution is to this scenario aside from vigilance.

Leveraging the current lists:

The existing tips/mods lists have excellent exposure on the web - tons of inbound links and lots of visitors. Once the wiki is going, I could link from the lists to the relevant wiki articles to encourage visitors to delve deeper... assuming the quality of the wiki ultimately exceeds the current lists, which I'm sure it will if EM members collectively take it on.

[Weather Spotter]

Originally Posted by MetroMPG

I support this!

Concern:

My only reservation of using the wiki is this kind of scenario: where it gets set up / edited by a few motivated members who eventually lose interest/move on (hey, it's life - that happens). Then it gets vandalized / polluted by misinformed or malicious users (it's life - this will also happen).

Not sure what the solution is to this scenario aside from vigilance.

Leveraging the current lists:

The existing tips/mods lists have excellent exposure on the web - tons of inbound links and lots of visitors. Once the wiki is going, I could link from the lists to the relevant wiki articles to encourage visitors to delve deeper... assuming the quality of the wiki ultimately exceeds the current lists, which I'm sure it will if EM members collectively take it on.

To help fix this I was recommending a Moderator who will watch over the Wiki, if that person wants to step down (lack of interest) I would expect them to contact a site admin and have a replacement chosen. A regular member might loose interest, but I expect more from a moderator.

your link back to a thread is a good one, how about a new category "Wiki discussion topics" to put these threads in (easy to find them all). the Wiki moderator could also watch over this area.

Ben

[SVOboy]

Since the wiki is "my baby," I would say this is a great idea. I've been nagging darin to add it to the header for ages so it would get more exposure. We can also link fleshed out entries from the lists.

[SVOboy]

Darin informs me that I'm insane and have been overlooking the link in the header for a long time. I guess my nagging in the past paid off. Anyway, I think it's a great idea, and would be good references for the tips list and we could make a big directory page linking around to the tips and link it from the main wiki page, as well.

[tumnasgt]

It looks like the config file needs correcting so the wiki doesn't think internal links are external.

I think the list of mods might work better in a table with brief details like price, difficulty, effectiveness, and payback time (with an assumption of the gas price). That way people can sort them to find mods that meet their requirements.
I'll have a play with wiki tables tomorrow and see how it would look (on a locally hosted wiki, so I don't change anybody else's work before I know I can get it to work right).