OBII Smarter than us?

[racprops]

OK I read up on hypermilling.

And OK it is more that coasting out of gear.

And I think being a Monk would be easier.

Pass.

Rich

[doviatt]

Nice! Most everyone here just got promoted to Monk status.

So, all you want is easy?!. No work? No effort? No science? No data? If I told you that I could get you a chip re-flashed (I know someone really smart) to make your V8 get 100-200 MPG driving 80 MPH....circumventing the gas companies efforts to suppress this information....
How much would you pay for such a thing? Oh, wait. You don't want to buy this. You don't want to develop this. You just want to be the one selling such a thing. No work, on your part.
I think you would have better luck selling magic weight loss pills. Lots more potential customers.
Yes, I'm being sarcastic. But, what is it that you do want?

[racprops]

Have you been reading any of my posts?? (The time and research I have done.)

Have you note I joined in 2009?? (Same year as you)

Have you looked at the picture of my Ford?? (Figure out how much work that took)

I have spent around $20,000.00 working on these things. OR more...

I came here looking for a simple answer to a simple question.

I got third degree over my wanting to know this answer. I answered honestly.

Which led us to all of this.

I wanted some real answers.

I got some.

Rich

[doviatt]

The time and research you have done. YES. Your set up in the Ford. Yes. $20,000? wow! Yes.
I have read all of this and wondered why?

Why would you do all of this with no real results, progress, or data? I do understand complicated things take time....

Yes, we signed up the same year. 2009. I have data. I have progress. I saved money all of these years thanks to this site not spent it. I went from 25 MPG in a Honda Accord before I signed up to realizing that it wasn't capable of saving me money for my previous jobs work commute.
My solution:
My last car: Acquisition cost a whopping $450
Efficiency log for: Grey Goose (Retired) - 1989 Geo Metro LSI 4 door hatch back

Lifetime Fuel Economy: 59.4 mpg (US), 4 L/100 km, 71.3 mpg (Imp)
90-day Fuel Economy: 1 mpg (US), 235.2 L/100 km, 1.2 mpg (Imp)
3-tank Fuel Economy: 54.1 mpg (US), 4.3 L/100 km, 65 mpg (Imp)
EPA Combined Rating / % over rating: 41 mpg (US) / -97.6% (based on 90-day fuel economy)
Total fills: 107
Average cost per gal/L: $3.09 per gal (US); $0.00 per L (price data entered for 45 fill/s)
Average cost per fill: $27.78
Average distance cost: $0.05 per mi. / $0.03 per km
Total fuel used: 934.67 gal (US), 3538.1 L
Total distance traveled: 55489.8 mi. / 89302.2 km
Total cost: $1,249.96
Total fuel saved vs. EPA: 418.7 gal. (US) / 1585 L
Total saved: $1293.78 (based on avg. cost per gal./L)
Average tank distance: 518.6 mi. / 834.6 km

Data!!!! Show me any of your data! Please! What have you learned over these years? Again I'll ask. What can you teach us?

[racprops]

First don't trust Dennis Lee and Dutchman Company nor Mike Holler, nor his wife.

Second the HAFC and the PICC by Dutchman don't work.

Third the Improv 2000 (a cold gas vapor unit) does not work. (tested on both 2000 Ford and on 84 and 93 Chevy Vans.)

Fourth The Gadgetman Grove (Throttle body Mod) does not work.
(See: Gadgetmangroove - Page 3 - Fuel Economy, Hypermiling, EcoModding News and Forum - EcoModder.com for more info)

Fifth The James version of the Throttle Body Grove does not work.

Sixth The EBN HHO Cell does does not work.

Seven The Volo FS chip does not work

Eight Reseting the A/F ratios works, that at 17:1 the Ford gets 5/6 MPG more and does not cause higher exhaust temps, that higher settings cause less MPG. These setting have major impact on power for take off.

Nine Fool the PCM and you fool the Scan GaugeII, which is what led me to this site and my buying three MPGunios.

Ten, for settings of the MPGunio for a 2000 Ford look for my posts about that.

Eleven The Hull Effect by Robert Hull does not work in a FI Car.

Twelve A split gas HHO (The Hydrogen and OX are kept apart and delivered to the car by themselves) does not work.

Thirteen The ED (A device you build to control the Injectors) does not work.

Fourteenth The Tuning 101 Modified (A Effe control device) does not work.

Fifteen A manual control changing the MAF sensor does not work. (sure fools the Scan GaugeII)

Sixteen The Dixie Caps do not work. (Caps put on top of injectors)

Seventeen O2 Extender Fittings do not work (both the 2000 Ford and my 93 Chevy Van)

Eighteen Advancing the Cam in a Chevy 350 Engine in a 93 Van does not work.(For MPG)

Nineteen Adding a lower air dam on a custom 93 Van does not work.(For MPG)

Twenty Adding ground effects to a custom 93 Chevy Van does not help Gas mileage BUT does help road stability from cross winds and does the air dam.

Twenty One Running 18 inch wheels and low profile tires does not majorly effect MPG and gives you a better handling car and van with more control in a blowout.

Twenty two Water injection does not work.

Twenty Three As far as I have been able to test for, up to a 30 AMP Load does not impact MPH, a/c does.

Twenty Four Higher Speed does lower MPG

Twenty Five A 2000 Ford cannot coast out of gear at idle, motor will run at higher RPM than it was in gear, this does not happen in a 93 Van nor a 91 Toyota.

Twenty Six Adding air foils (Vortex) to a 93 Van does not work. (look at the rear end of my Van in the pictures to see what I am talking about)

Twenty Seven A Ozone venting system to the Motor does not work for MPG, but seems to prolong the life of a Distributor Cap and Rotor.

Twenty Eight The Zemco Mileage Computer will not work on a FI Car due to the fuel return system, should work on a newer returnless FI Cars.

Twenty Nine a TH209R4 can improve a 79 Camaro 305's Take off due to the faster first gear, and its OD and rejetting the Quad can improve its MPG, I used to get at fill ups 14 to 19 overall MPG. I now wish I had tested it for a 100 to 200 MPG Highway run. As my Ford get nearly the same combined MPG and also gets 27/30 Highway....

Thirty Swapping a Olds 305 into a 84 Chevy van replacing a 350 DOES NOT get better MPG due to the smaller motor, in fact it gets worst, drown fro 16 MPG to 10 MPG AND it is so slow on mountains I was honked at and in the way for Semi Trucks as I often had to down shift to second.

Thirty One The EnPVC Valve does not improve MPG but does seem to keep the oil cleaner longer.

Thirty Two, trying to over ride the Gas Vapor Valve in a 2000 Ford does not help MPG.

Thirty Three A Ozone Generator in the intake air hose failed due to shorting out to the hose..seems the air and water hoses are laced with carbon or metal to ground any static and NOT true rubber hoses. These hoses also shorted out the Hull effect.

Thirty Four Do not make changes to a car stock system unless you really need to: Consider that GM once tried to mount a Carb with only three bolts, they figured they would save millions in bolt costs and in labor in drill and tapping and not installing that forth bolt. So if they could remove anything and still keep the car running correctly they would. (I learned this the hard way as a teenager with a 67 Cougar XR7)

Thirty Five, a Quad carb seems to get one to two MPG more due to it smaller primary over other carbs like the Carter AFB.

Thirty Six Older manual Borg Warner Over Drives could free wheel. (a automatic coasting system that was a little safer that shifting out of gear, you lost engine braking but could speed up by hitting the gas.)

Thirty Seven High Performance DOES NOT mean better, only that these parts are for hard performance.. Like Slotted and drilled rotors, and High Performance Pads..rotors vibrated and disk pads need to heat up to work right...I found this to be true across the board.

Thirty Eight Almost all performance engine products cost MPG, performance Cams shift the RPM range higher, losing low RPM Torque in favor of higher RPM power..and so on and so on.

Thirty Nine I fully believe that the reason we now get 100,000 plus in our cars are due to Fuel Injection, two reasons, one you do not start a cold motor by pumping in one or two shots of raw gas into the intake, and two due to how a FI car take two or more full revolution before starting, this allows OIL pressure to be built before firing, My old Carb Cars could fire on 1/2 turn. And better metals and building specs, all to fill the mandated smog systems last the life of the car, or 100,000 miles.

Forty I also fully believe our cars could get much better gas mileage. That they are rigged not to.

See Shell Opel as ONE proof of the possibility.


All the above "do not work" applies to my work with my 2000 Mercury Grand Marques (Ford), my 93 Van and my 1991 Toyota Camry Wagon and others.. I cannot say these devices do not nor cannot work in other cars.

I consider the possibility all (well some, some I did test fully) of these failures could be my fault, that due to some lack of information or knowledge I missed or did something wrong.

This summer due to new information and being told some "mistakes" I may have made with HHO, I follow the new instructions and retried HHO. Only to have it fail again.

The quest goes on.

Is that enough?

Rich

[racprops]

Nice, so you drive like a 90 year old man and saved some money.

I work at home so I do not drive to work, I walk into my shop. I cannot figure how much money and gas I have saved over my 30+ years doing what I do. I bet it is more than yours.

When I drive I drive as fast as I want and I keep up with traffic or a little faster. I am not a danger or problem to other drivers.

I enjoy the performance of my Car.

Why?? Why all of the above Post??

Because my current product is fading in sales and it is custom made and only I can do them. (I cannot farm them out nor hire others to make them for me.)

I wanted a new business that others could do and that I could make money teaching, and selling product. A product that I can farm out to other shops, and that I can hire workers to make and to sell and to install.

The Dutchman HAFC System held out that hope and plan.

I had a deal in place that IF they had not lied could have made me millions.

And most of that would have been by less work on my part. As a distributor.

So I am gambling big for a big payoff.

Nothing done here can say that, you cannot box up your hypermilling nor your aerodynamics improvements and sell them to Joe down the street. Joe has to fight Rush Hour Traffic, has to worry about getting to work on time. He does not have time or even the mind set to hypermill.

Sadly under such conduction I don't think any fuel saving device will be much help, but every little bit will help. Personally I feel a all electric or The Air Car is the best thing for commuting to and from work.

I am looking for a device or system that can improve MPG by at lease 30% and be sold and installed for under $1000.00.

Such a device or system then would free me to working on better and higher MPG improvements.

That such device or system then could provide for my old age and retirement.

Rich

Originally Posted by doviatt

The time and research you have done. YES. Your set up in the Ford. Yes. $20,000? wow! Yes.
I have read all of this and wondered why?

Why would you do all of this with no real results, progress, or data? I do understand complicated things take time....

Yes, we signed up the same year. 2009. I have data. I have progress. I saved money all of these years thanks to this site not spent it. I went from 25 MPG in a Honda Accord before I signed up to realizing that it wasn't capable of saving me money for my previous jobs work commute.
My solution:
My last car: Acquisition cost a whopping $450
Efficiency log for: Grey Goose (Retired) - 1989 Geo Metro LSI 4 door hatch back

Lifetime Fuel Economy: 59.4 mpg (US), 4 L/100 km, 71.3 mpg (Imp)
90-day Fuel Economy: 1 mpg (US), 235.2 L/100 km, 1.2 mpg (Imp)
3-tank Fuel Economy: 54.1 mpg (US), 4.3 L/100 km, 65 mpg (Imp)
EPA Combined Rating / % over rating: 41 mpg (US) / -97.6% (based on 90-day fuel economy)
Total fills: 107
Average cost per gal/L: $3.09 per gal (US); $0.00 per L (price data entered for 45 fill/s)
Average cost per fill: $27.78
Average distance cost: $0.05 per mi. / $0.03 per km
Total fuel used: 934.67 gal (US), 3538.1 L
Total distance traveled: 55489.8 mi. / 89302.2 km
Total cost: $1,249.96
Total fuel saved vs. EPA: 418.7 gal. (US) / 1585 L
Total saved: $1293.78 (based on avg. cost per gal./L)
Average tank distance: 518.6 mi. / 834.6 km

Data!!!! Show me any of your data! Please! What have you learned over these years? Again I'll ask. What can you teach us?

[doviatt]

You have summed up the entire contents of the corral in one post. That is impressive in itself.
I was more interested in data on things that did work to help support your end goal.
You are here with a pile of things that didn't work. You are asking for one, any one thing that you can package up and sale for profit. One simple device that every one can use on any car that guarantees efficiency no matter how inefficiently you drive. This thing you seek doesn't exist. There are a lot of smart people here (not including myself) that have experience, knowledge, science. Why discount their words, input and advice?

[racprops]

Originally Posted by doviatt

You have summed up the entire contents of the corral in one post. That is impressive in itself.
I was more interested in data on things that did work to help support your end goal.
You are here with a pile of things that didn't work. You are asking for one, any one thing that you can package up and sale for profit. One simple device that every one can use on any car that guarantees efficiency no matter how inefficiently you drive. This thing you seek doesn't exist. There are a lot of smart people here (not including myself) that have experience, knowledge, science. Why discount their words, input and advice?

And your last word earlier was:

" What can you teach us?"

That was what my answer was, what could I tell you.


"Why discount their words, input and advice?"

I don't the ones that seem to know what they are talking about like RustyLugNut, he seems to have real knowledge.

You might want to reread his posts.

Rich

[doviatt]

Originally Posted by racprops

"Why discount their words, input and advice?"

I don't the ones that seem to know what they are talking about like RustyLugNut, he seems to have real knowledge.

You might want to reread his posts.

Rich

But you do judge and dismiss others without trying to understand the message being sent. I am not disagreeing with you I am merely trying to help you understand and be open and receptive with ideas that don't support your quest. I did reread his posts- RustyLugNut dismissed your vapor claim but he did it in a way that hopefully you listened, learned and understood.

[racprops]

Funny but I saw a little help and hope in his posts.

AND he also seems to have some luck with HHO.

And I don't dismiss them out of hand, BUT the answers of aerodynamics and Hypermilling are no help to me.

Only Die Hards will put a full belly pan on, or remove side mirrors and wipers and make a boat tail for their cars and the dozen of other things suggested.

Most people do not want to look like a Nut driving their cars.

Most want cool performance cars that CAN get good MPG when needed and kick tail when needed.

I feel that there is TOO much real evidence of some of these things working.

I am fairly sure it can be done, problem is if it will be cost effective.

Rich