The climate change consensus extends beyond climate scientists

[sendler]

Unfortunately our explosive growth in numbers over the last 150 years has pinned us between a rock and a hard place. Given the choice between global warming, and a much sooner complete collapse of world society due to a reduction in energy availability, no government or general populace is going to choose collapse. You are reading one of the many books that explains the relationship between energy availability (and the obvious inability of rebuildables to replace fossil fuels at anywhere this scale), economy, and population.
,
If energy availability goes down, one or both of the others must go down.

[aerohead]

Originally Posted by sendler

So you are reading The Long Emergency but seem to have been dismissing the Nate Hagens Blindspot lecture and most of what I have been saying. I am hopeful that more people can wake to the coming changes that energy and resource depletion will force on us in the next 20-30 years and work to raise awareness.

I haven't finished 'Long',so I'll refrain from comment on that until I've made it through.Like so many titles,by the time Kuntsler does the research,does the manuscript, editing,proofing,and publishing,the information is already obsolete.A lot has happened since it's publishing.
I did watch Hagen's 'Blindspot' lecture in it's entirety.I came away feeling like there's some things Nate doesn't know he doesn't know,and things he shares are contextual,without expressing so.Which leaves the audience at a disadvantage.
I'm also auditing the Great Courses', by Columbia University, DVD lecture series' Physics of History,and have found at least one,what I believe to be,a climate change comment mistake by Dr.Helfand.

[aerohead]

Originally Posted by sendler

Unfortunately our explosive growth in numbers over the last 150 years has pinned us between a rock and a hard place. Given the choice between global warming, and a much sooner complete collapse of world society due to a reduction in energy availability, no government or general populace is going to choose collapse. You are reading one of the many books that explains the relationship between energy availability (and the obvious inability of rebuildables to replace fossil fuels at anywhere this scale), economy, and population.
,
If energy availability goes down, one or both of the others must go down.

A look at WW-II history is illuminating with respect to 'scale' of energy demand.
Some significant percentage of the US population and their energy use can be 'disappeared',quite literally overnight with the stroke of a pen.
And Kuntsler eludes to this.Sure,Barbie and Ken aren't going to like it,but they'll have no choice but to go along.
We can take our 'haircut' sooner,or we can take it later,at orders of magnitude higher in pain level.
If the Barbies and Kens of the USA have to be interned in concentration camps to protect the country,well,we have a historical precedent for that.

[aerohead]

Originally Posted by Xist

I read a sci fi story where a kid's mom died in the "Food mines." They turned coal into food?

If you could turn one form of carbon into another, I am sure there are easier ways of obtaining it than digging miles underground, like maybe taking some nice vegetables and feeding them to animals.

soylent green!(Make room,make room)

[sendler]

The haircut sooner is much better. Talk it up. No one is thinking about this at all. Most have been green washed by the false hope of rebuildables ability to just step in with business as usual to seamlessly replace all fossil fuels.
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Here is a good review and synopsis of The Long Emergency to save those that don't have time to start reading on these subjects. He is just one of many wise writers who's work has been summarily dismissed as so dissonant that it couldn't possibly have merit.
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https://www.resilience.org/stories/2...0-years-later/
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[aerohead]

Originally Posted by freebeard

I was thinking of these ones:
http://cosmicconvergence.org/wp-cont...1-1024x609.png
from DDG, not endorsing the web site
Maybe they're Photoshopped.

Yeah,it's just frozen water vapor.You'll see the same thing coming out of automobiles under frigid conditions.

[freebeard]

Why are the flight paths spread evenly horizontally and parallel, and do you see any vertical separation?

A look at WW-II history is illuminating with respect to 'scale' of energy demand.
Some significant percentage of the US population and their energy use can be 'disappeared',quite literally overnight with the stroke of a pen.
And Kuntsler eludes to this.Sure,Barbie and Ken aren't going to like it,but they'll have no choice but to go along.
We can take our 'haircut' sooner,or we can take it later,at orders of magnitude higher in pain level.
If the Barbies and Kens of the USA have to be interned in concentration camps to protect the country,well,we have a historical precedent for that.

Not our proudest moment.

I think the solution is not pen strokes and concentration camps. And the hippys had a 'no haircut' solution. ()

The solution is between people's ears.

[aerohead]

Originally Posted by freebeard

Why are the flight paths spread evenly horizontally and parallel, and do you see any vertical separation?



Not our proudest moment.

I think the solution is not pen strokes and concentration camps. And the hippys had a 'no haircut' solution. ()

The solution is between people's ears.

It's hard to discern vertical separation from the photos.
Most of my uncles flew,I got to fly with two of them.
My brother flew until a few years ago.I flew with him.
Paul McCartney's old trumpet player from Wings still flies and I've flown some of his planes.
This is just general aviation stuff,although Steve has flown commercial jets and one of his buddies,Andy, is a captain with Southwest Airlines.
And one of Steve's band mates is an air traffic controller for DFW.
Turbulence is bad news and mid-air collisions are worse.The FAA does everything it can to keep aircraft away from one another.
The cross-hatch pattern is a consequence from the rule book.
ATC will assign a heading and assigned altitude for any given flight.You are required to fly that heading and altitude, and unless you radio in a request to change, due to ,say, wing icing,and receive permission to ascend out of the weather,or drop to warmer air, the pilot must maintain their assigned flight path.
The pilot IS the CAPTAIN,and may do what they believe necessary to avert a disaster,but they may have to explain themselves to their flight-following ATC.

[oil pan 4]

Originally Posted by aerohead

I'm just going to interject that,if the climate scientists are correct,coal combustion cannot be part of the energy equation going into the future.
Carbon-capture appears to be quite literally a 'pipe dream.'
Syngas is not economically feasible,nor it's carbon dioxide emissions.
Syn-fuel,ditto.
It's certainly not good news for the coal industry.

Well they haven't been correct yet.

[All Darc]

Hydrogen & birthday...
Not a good idea :

Woman horrifically burned after birthday candles ignite hydrogen-filled balloons | Fox News