The climate change consensus extends beyond climate scientists

[aerohead]

Originally Posted by oil pan 4

That's a pipe dream. It says to get 80% to 90% of energy from sources that stop working before dusk or stop working shortly after the sun sets.
Then all you need to make it work is an impossible amount of battery capacity that doesn't exist.

So what's the solution if we want to maintain some semblance of 'normalcy',without a carbon footprint?
I know your on board with nuclear,and you're already driving an EV,and doing home PV and carbon-neutral heating.
What are some of the other technological options available?
Should we attempt utility-scale energy storage if it can be done?

[aerohead]

Originally Posted by Xist

Ya'll need Jesus. I will see you in the other threads, but I do not see this one going anywhere.

Aerohead, and NeilBlanchard, you guys seem more interested in contradicting people than responding to what they actually write. Freebeard, you too, but you are also eager to share obscure things that are barely relevant.

Oil Pan, you are a complicated man. You say that everything is fine, but you love your Leaf, and are installing solar panels, although you explain how these save you money.

Sendler and RedPoint, you make good points, but people intentionally misunderstand you.

RedDevil, do you know what Mark Twain said about finding yourself in the majority?

Redneck, your posts are weird.

I skimmed all of the posts going back to #3841. I cannot imagine anyone feeling left out, but if you do, remember:

Nobody cares about my opinion anyway.

Do push-ups and eat your vegetables!

I left you a blow by blow reply with all the specificity I could muster without my library.Since you've publicly insulted me and all my friends perhaps you'll be gentleman enough to read through it.
PS I do appreciate your opinion.It's a way to stand in your moccasins and peer out on the same planet with a second set of eyes.Corporations spend untold sums gathering as many a perspective as they can,in order to make the best decisions.
I'm not the sharpest knife in the drawer.Many will attest to that.My best decision making will come after I've accumulated all the input I can get.
If you're bent on leaving the thread,then please accept a thank you from me,for taking the time and energy to share your insights.

[NeilBlanchard]

Originally Posted by oil pan 4

That's a pipe dream. It says to get 80% to 90% of energy from sources that stop working before dusk or stop working shortly after the sun sets.
Then all you need to make it work is an impossible amount of battery capacity that doesn't exist.

Are we lazy? Can't we use our brains to figure out a solution? I think you underestimate what the people who did this planning understand.

How is it that Orkney can produce MORE than 100% of the energy they need? They have a lot of darkness in Orkney.

[RedDevil]

Originally Posted by Xist

Ya'll need Jesus. I will see you in the other threads, but I do not see this one going anywhere.
...
RedDevil, do you know what Mark Twain said about finding yourself in the majority?
...
Do push-ups and eat your vegetables!

I can do with a little less sitting back and reflecting, thank you!
Pushups: about 12 daily, but MPMV.
Vegetables- and fruit. We had apples that weighed a pound a piece. I eat an apple for lunch. My lunch made my coworkers stare in disbelief

This thread going nowhere: what... You don't dare suggest... someone actually REPEATED himself?

[NeilBlanchard]

Typhoon Haiyan Survivor: Fossil Fuel Companies Killed My Family by Hastening Climate Change

Winona LaDuke Calls for Indigenous-Led “Green New Deal” as She Fights Minnesota Pipeline Expansion

[aerohead]

I just looked in on this lawsuit,and there has been some activity.It's been mentioned once on TV,and one time that I'm aware of.
When television broadcasters accept petroleum advertising revenue,it seems to 'Zika-virus' the editorial staff of the network.
Don't bite the barrel you suck from.

[oil pan 4]

Originally Posted by aerohead

So what's the solution if we want to maintain some semblance of 'normalcy',without a carbon footprint?
I know your on board with nuclear,and you're already driving an EV,and doing home PV and carbon-neutral heating.
What are some of the other technological options available?
Should we attempt utility-scale energy storage if it can be done?

Nuclear.
If it can be done yes.
Right now there is just barely enough batteries available for building 1 or 2% of all vehicles sold to be electric.
Maybe the glass matrix electrolyte battery will pan out and we can just use actual lithium metal in a secondary cell with out it accidentally turning into a firebomb. Use sodium metal batteries for grid storage.
Right now making grid batteries would only drive up the price and availability of materials for traction batteries.

[oil pan 4]

Originally Posted by NeilBlanchard

Are we lazy? Can't we use our brains to figure out a solution? I think you underestimate what the people who did this planning understand.

How is it that Orkney can produce MORE than 100% of the energy they need? They have a lot of darkness in Orkney.

Based on the behavior of the believers it looks Ike there is no will to try and change.
We have the solution, its called nuclear energy.

[sendler]

Originally Posted by oil pan 4

That's a pipe dream. It says to get 80% to 90% of energy from sources that stop working before dusk or stop working shortly after the sun sets.
Then all you need to make it work is an impossible amount of battery capacity that doesn't exist.

Our 100% Clean Energy Vision - The Solutions Project
,

There is an incredible amount of dreamy dialog that fails to address the issue of scale or a practical implementation. I understand that they are somewhat intentionally misleading us to try to steer the conversation for good. But sappy optimism will prove just as dangerous as denialism as it will lead to complacency and ineffective decisions on infrastructure that requires decades to construct. And our fossil energy endowment that is required to build big things will soon start to slip away.
.
The USA is using over 3 TerraWatts average. The world is over 17 TW. How much lower could this be using the pen of government mandates before martial law is required? What happens when the contraction of energy consumption obsoletes the debt based economy? Absolving world debt with the stroke of a pen also absolves all personal wealth that exists in currency or digits as one monetary marker is called in and replaced by a newer one.
.
For modern countries to even cut energy to 1/2 of what is currently being used would require everything to change. All built out ICE machines. Living space. Food. Working. "Jobs". Income distribution. Government.
.
1.5 TW is still huge. If you add it up as MacKay said, to power a country on rebuildables requires that they are country sized. Where do we get all of this stuff?
.
One million 2MW on shore wind turbines make .6 TW. How many days to build and install each turbine?
.
Four thousand 500 MW Topaz sized solar farms if located in the desert make .5 TW. How many years or months to build each farm? Double the number of panels and count on many days of zero output in the winter for any that are located in the North East USA or Europe where it snows.
.
You have heard of the BigF'nBattery in Australia. It takes three hundred thousand of these to store just twenty hours of a 1.5 TW rate. Just for the USA. This is the entire annual output of the GigaFactory for eight hundred years to make this many batteries.
.
I agree.
.
These dreamy writers of renewable plans need to find an engineering major (or High School student) to do the math.

[Vman455]

Originally Posted by sendler

Our 100% Clean Energy Vision - The Solutions Project
,

There is an incredible amount of dreamy dialog that fails to address the issue of scale or a practical implementation. I understand that they are somewhat intentionally misleading us to try to steer the conversation for good. But sappy optimism will prove just as dangerous as denialism as it will lead to complacency and ineffective decisions on infrastructure that requires decades to construct. And our fossil energy endowment that is required to build big things will soon start to slip away.

Wow, they "forecast" a 54.5% reduction in energy demand by the city of Chicago by 2050, just from switching to wind and solar!

I'll have what she's having.