The climate change consensus extends beyond climate scientists

[aerohead]

Originally Posted by redpoint5

I thought you were speaking in terms of domestic protection. The same concept applies though; that if there was not a government protecting assets, that private business would fund their own protection (and often do). It would simply be reflected in the price of the goods.

You're correct that evolution dictates what is a right. Bears have the right to bear claws, for instance. Our claws are more effective.

In earlier times you could hire the Pinkerton's,private army.You'll see this portrayed on David Milch's Deadwood, HBO series.Henry Ford had his own goon squad.United Fruit Company (now Chiquita) would machine gun their employees.A Houstonian-owned Coca Coal bottling plant would murder their employees.
Bigger dogs like Theodore Roosevelt just bring in the US Navy to threaten annihilation to anyone who tries to defend the territory the US has just stolen from them.
If the Navy ever has an accident,you can blame that on someone else and take their Cuba,Puerto Rico,and Philippine Islands.
Islands that are defenseless you just take and give to pineapple growers.
Careful with Korea though,they've sent even the US Marine Corps packing.
Currently,we've done like Hitler.Instead of nationalizing industry,they nationalized the people,and made them foot the bill for business protection.
I defend the right to arm bears.

[aerohead]

Originally Posted by freebeard

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Inch for those following along at home.



A privilege can be bestowed. A right is inalienable.

When I think of self-defense,I consider non-language,non-thinking,immediate reptilian brain mobilization for action.
You may be correct.I'm not a linguist.I'll try and remember to look it up.

[aerohead]

ABC NEWS,June 11,2019
That silly Earth didn't get the memo! Even though the Sun's output has been declining since the 1960s,the planet continues to warm.It must be all that hot air Aerohead's been releasing.

[redpoint5]

Originally Posted by aerohead

IUnited Fruit Company (now Chiquita) would machine gun their employees.

From Wiki, it was the Columbian army of Miguel Abadía Méndez that massacred the people. Still not ok, but in principle I have no problem with a private security force. Groups of people are prone to misbehave regardless if they are organized as a private business, government body, or soccer hooligans.

[aerohead]

Originally Posted by redpoint5

From Wiki, it was the Columbian army of Miguel Abadía Méndez that massacred the people. Still not ok, but in principle I have no problem with a private security force. Groups of people are prone to misbehave regardless if they are organized as a private business, government body, or soccer hooligans.

Yep,we're capable of all sorts of behaviors.It is what it is.'all it's ever been.All it's ever going to be.'cause that's what people do.

[freebeard]

I'll try and remember to look it up.

The Declaration of Independence: Full text

It must be all that hot air Aerohead's been releasing.

You capitalize your own screen name?

Originally Posted by redpoint5

Still not ok, but in principle I have no problem with a private security force. Groups of people are prone to misbehave regardless if they are organized as a private business, government body, or soccer hooligans.

What is different today is that the USofA has a Chief Executive who's private security force is better than a corrupted Department of Justice.
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[NeilBlanchard]

IF we do not react to the FACTS WE KNOW - and continue to keep coasting along on burning fossil fuels - then we are FUCT.

We need to address our climate crisis, among other things.

List of OTHER things we are doing that is causing massive damage:
* Killing life in the soil with artificial fertilizers, herbicides, and pesticides - the soil is the basis of most life on the planet, and we are totally dependent on it
* Causing massive soil erosion by laying the soil bare and using chemicals (see above) - this harms its ability to absorb and clean water
* Overusing water and depleting aquifers
* chemical pollution including mercury, dioxins, lead, MBTE
* over-fishing
* factory farming - in addition to soil damage and water overuse, and poisons, and adding GHG - this causes huge health problems, because of processed foods, overuse of sweeteners, loss of many nutrients due to poor soil health. Case in point: tomatoes are grown so they don't get crushed at the bottom of a dump truck - NOT for their flavor and nutrients from fully ripening
* plastic pollution
* clear cutting forests
* plowing under grasslands
* creating super weeds and having chemical-dependent crops
* creating vast monocultures - agriculture, lawns
* indiscriminate use of insecticides - there is at least a 70% drop in flying insects
* injecting poisons into the ground with fracking
* paving over vast areas of land and buildings - reduces the land available for the water cycle, and kills life in that soil

Our use of artificial nitrogen fertilizer (made from natural gas) is not only killing the soil, and poisoning the water, and causing dead zones in the ocean - it ends up as nitrous oxide, which is about 8X stronger a greenhouse gas as methane.

The tundra is melting - at a quicker rate than we thought. This is releasing carbon dioxide, methane, and nitrous oxide.

The ocean is warming, so it will start to release the gases it has been absorbing - so most of our carbon dioxide emissions will be released in a very short period of time. It will also release oxygen. It could become a source of hydrogen sulfide.

Methane clathrates that are frozen on the Arctic ocean floor will melt at some point.

We must act to change how we are doing things - by changing HOW WE THINK.

[redpoint5]

I agree with a little over half of that list.

Clear cutting has been shown to usually be the most environmentally friendly way to harvest timber. Selective harvesting doesn't give saplings a chance to grow since the surrounding trees are already established. The saplings need to grow at the same rate in a clear cut area.

Farming animals is efficient, and fish are no different.

Pesticides are a necessary evil. Eliminate pesticides and fertilizers, and the world starves to death. The key is to apply them carefully, being mindful of water run off.

Nature doesn't care about my tiny monoculture yard. There's a lot of nature, and practically no yard.

We'll be fine. In fact, I'll make the prediction now that in 20 years most of us will be doing much better, minus the havoc 20 years of aging will have on our bodies.

[oil pan 4]

People who don't like clear cutting never bothered to look at the clear cut area 2 or 3 years later.
In maine the birds, moose, deer, rabbets, coons, skunks, bears flood into these areas because they can eat absolutely everything.
Everything is so green and short fires can't burn through the area.
They normally don't cut everything. Usually leave some of the nicest, straightest most desirable species of trees behind. About 1 for every 2 or 3 acres as seeding trees.

[sendler]

[QUOTE=redpoint5;600150]I agree with a little over half of that list.
Farming animals is efficient, and fish are no different.

Pesticides are a necessary evil. Eliminate pesticides and fertilizers, and the world starves to death. The key is to apply them carefully, being mindful of water run off.

/QUOTE]

This is the point that most current climate only (not viewing the big picture) activists totally do not understand. Mechanized factory farming with hybrid/ GMO crops using artificial fertilizer and pesticides eliminated what would have been mass starvation starting in the 70's. And the population has even doubled again since 1970. We cannot suddenly stop big agro without starvation. We cannot suddenly reduce access to energy without deprivation. We must buy time with further techno advances to stretch the resources we have left and learn to coast back down with a new social system to where more of the population can grow more of their own food, fiber, and firewood themselves organically once again. And where people in OECD countries can thrive and be happy in an economic system that works with much less material and energy throughput while we uplift living standards and education in the global South to encourage and enable lower fertility rates.