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Old 08-05-2010, 06:05 PM   #21 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arragonis View Post
You will have to forgive the fun poking here as there have been a lot of claims about magnets. They give power, they improve FE, they make cars not designed for unleaded fuel suitable for use with it, they make cars fly, they make handling better, the cure arthritis, they cure colds - anything you can think of.
Well they used to make cars fly, but apparently junk yards use mechanical claws now instead of giant electro-magnets on cars.

This thread reminds me of the first time I heard that putting a magnet on my fuel line would improve FE, the picture looked a lot like the one in the link,

Digi-Key - 240-2074-ND (Manufacturer - 28A2025-0A0)

but priced at $19.95.

In all seriousness, for a magnet to do anything to a molecule it has to be ferous, or polar. I'm pretty sure the molecules in your fuel are not polar. And even if it were it would take one powerfull magnet to do anything. And even then the alignment it did would undo as soon as it left the field.

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Old 08-05-2010, 07:26 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by hondo434 View Post
Shadetree mechanic, What did you want to say about the logs?
Simple comparison. You say the magnets do wonders for gas mileage, but I'm not far behind you in average MPG and there's another guy doing a lot better than either of us. It's the scientific process. In an expirement, you have a control to compare against. I don't use magnets, you do, yet our mpg figures are nearly identical. That would make mine almost a control--I don't live in the same area as you do, so the gas here isn't exactly the same, maybe, but I do have more hills to climb.

To prove a point, you are better off to provide tons of reputable data and let the data do the arguing than to simply reassert your point repeatedly without giving any data to discuss.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jamesqf View Post
I think you missed the point I was trying to make, which is that it's not rational to do either speed or fuel economy mods for economic reasons. You do it as a form of recreation, for the fun and for the challenge.
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Old 08-05-2010, 07:51 PM   #23 (permalink)
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Shadetreemechanic, This is good you found some compareable data. Just to show some difference in driving conditions, My maxima is a second car and gets little use. I only drive 1-2 miles at a time so it is tough city driving with cold engine etc. I still get those mpg's. Last year I had a chance to take a short trip to syracuse ny, about 85 miles to visit relatives. I had three people in car and a trunk full of stuff. On that trip a got close to 35mpg. That was the first highway miles I had driven and none since. That just verified that the car was getting better milage.
We usually drive the 06 altima on trips and local driving. I looked at your driving record and it looks like your mostly highway miles. The other max looks like a hypermiler and may be doing extra steps to increase milage. I don't hypermile.
I see you take good care of the your max. and seem to keep good records.
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Old 08-06-2010, 03:04 AM   #24 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by hondo434 View Post
Arragonis, Thank you for your wise reply. I see your Scottish. My great uncle served in the Black Watch in the war (probably I). His name is listed somewhere, maybe Edinburgh. He was with the Argyll & Sutherland Highlanders 2nd Battalion.
I take your advice with the utmost respect, I'm afraid the A-B-A test is not going to work in a timely fashion. Whatever caused the milage to increase has done it permanantly. When I took it off nothing changed. I think the ECU has been changed and won't change until the orginal state of the vehicle is returned.
Special testing equipment for reading the ECU parameters may be needed when doing tests to monitor changes in the ECU.
I'm glad you stayed and got over the friendly fun poking. I see Shade has found some other comparible results from similar cars.

I need to change my location a little as I live in Scotland but I'm actually English - only been here since 99 when I got married. I have relatives from WW1 but they were volunteers from the 'pals' batalions - the ones which came from the same place, sometimes the same factory in the Industrial parts of England. They stopped this idea after the big losses on the western front where a pals battalion could suffer 80-90% casualties - effectively wiping out all of the young men from a local area in one go.

There is a Black Watch WW1 memorial in Edinburgh Castle so if you grandfather is named he will be on there.

The Scottish National War Memorial

Good luck and happy Hypermiling.
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Old 08-06-2010, 03:33 AM   #25 (permalink)
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Sorry if you thought I was not taking you seriously or poking fun at you, but i feel there may be other factors than the magnets. how you use the care you current conciousness of fuel usage etc could all be a factor - even different brands of gas can do a bit!

From my work with fuels and EM Fields (uni projects) I can find now evidence that the Gasoline is effected by the application of flux. Even it you are talking hi-density neodynium mags you're more likely have upset a sensor or the ECU through EM interference than do anything to the fuel.

Secondly the Carpet theory doesn't really hold much water either sadly sorry. 'using firction in a pipe to 'excite' the fuel would increase the pumping load and likely ruin your pump from overload (magnets post pump) or potentially cavitation fatigue (pre pump).


Sorry to be a kill joy i'm just trying to use the experience I have to give an opinion
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Old 08-06-2010, 08:23 AM   #26 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hondo434 View Post
I am convinced the magnets are the cause as they are the only variable.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hondo434 View Post
I am not saying that the magnets are causing the increase in milage
I'm confused. Which position are you taking?

Also, I strongly doubt the magnets were the only variable that changed between adding them and drawing your conclusion.

FYI: http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthrea...ery-11445.html
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Old 08-06-2010, 09:28 AM   #27 (permalink)
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Robchalmers, First, I was not singling you out as " poking fun" but more of a general observation of human behavior. You have good experience and you bring up valid concerns. I am just brainstorming. When I purchased the magnet set, the vendor sent an instruction sheet. He mapped out what to do and what to watch for. He said change the oil or have clean oil then drive 1-2 tankfuls of gas ,then check oil. He said the oil will be black from cleaning out the combustion chamber, I followed the instructions and when I changed the oil it was pitch black and full of carbon chunks. He also said if no change was noticed that you should disconnect battery and wait 30 minutes to reset ECU parameters then go drive on highway , this would be done after running through several tanks of gas. I don't know if that was necessary, but I ended up disconnecting the battery anyway to add another device .
Since you have some EM experience I will give you the specs. on the Magnets I am using. The magnets are small n42 disc magnets axially magnatized. They are assembled in a row ( 5-6 discs) inside a strip of velcro, which makes it easy to apply around the fuel line. I install around the fuel line on rubber section closest to the injectors. That is it. Maybe you can duplicate it.
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Old 08-06-2010, 10:08 AM   #28 (permalink)
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metrompg, I may be having trouble expressing my thoughts. I think I am saying that the magnets caused something to happen but may or may not be actually increasing mpg. If that makes sense.
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Old 08-06-2010, 10:24 AM   #29 (permalink)
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n42's seem a little small. Sadly i can't replicate the idea as I run a diesel. To me it just sounds like he told to you to do a service and reset, with the engine running fresh oil it'll probably feel a hell of a lot better anyway!

I'm not sure how it would cause the petrol to de-coke the engine either, sorry to say that sounds like grade A BullSquash, De-Coking while running surely would send it out the exhaust and wouldn't form chunks during, an explosion.

just my 2cents
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Old 08-06-2010, 10:24 AM   #30 (permalink)
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I tried the commercial fuel line magnets on my previous vehicle, and nothing changed.

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