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Old 08-31-2019, 07:11 PM   #141 (permalink)
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Back to the thematic about meat, protein feed populations, and meat replacers to save animals, I found a interesting thing.

Well, like we all know we have natural and essential aminoacids. Acording sciene we need only to take essential aminoacids (8 types) to survive, since our body is capable to synthesize natural aminoacids (12 types).
The cost to industrial produce synthetic aminoacids today it's lower than ever, and there are studies about reduce cost of animal feeding by using only synthetic essential aminoacids, mixing some of it with conventional ration, reduzing the need of ration for birds, for example.

Maybe they could consider aminoacids suplementation as a way to reduce protein needs in food, since they just need to add essential aminoacids, while proteins have natural and essential aminoacids.

So, the meat replacements, in general with less protein than meat, and specially the vegan cheeses (most very poor in protein --exception to tofu--), would have a good benefit of get essential aminoacids.

But I'm confused. Have long term studies being made about reduce intake of natural aminoacids and use mostly essential aminoacids?
What if someone took only essential aminoacids and no natural aminoacids for a long time? What changes? Will somebody get higher methabolism due higher need to self (body) synthesize the natural aminoacids?
How it would affect the body, the enzymes, liver?


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Old 09-15-2019, 12:58 PM   #142 (permalink)
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news.slashdot.org/.../are-plant-based-meat-alternatives-really-healthier-than-meat
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Plant-based/meat-free entrees are coming to major fast-food chains including White Castle, KFC, Del Taco, the Cheesecake Factory, and Subway. There's just one problem, argues an opinion piece by a certified nutritionist at NBC News: "these offerings aren't actually any healthier."
[snip]
But "If eating more realistic fake meat was about health, the offerings would be far lower in salt content, contain fewer calories and have a bit less dietary fat. None of them do..."
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Old 09-15-2019, 02:48 PM   #143 (permalink)
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Yeah, I commented something like that in other posts. Indeed many fake meat (vegan meat replacers) like plant burger that try to mimic meat, have more salt and as much or more fat, like coconut fat (saturated fat) than real meat burgers.
About salt vegan burger of second generation (try to mimic flavor and texture of beef) it's compared to raw beef, but I imagine even most cooked beef burger have less salt than such vegan burgers.

The actual fashion of vegan burgers, like Impossible Burger or Beyound Burger, it's more to attract meat eater, rather than take vegans. It's more conneted to save animals and save land, the environment.

People's taste, at least from meat eaters, are often used with much fat and salt, used with strong flavors. When someone quit eat meat the sense of taste changes, get more sensible, and many thing a person disliked starts to got taste. That's why I think vegans should demand vegan burgers with heaqltier recipe, cause if they start to eat too much of Beyond and Impossible burgers thay can drop their health situation in terms of blood pressure and cholesterol.

Today there are some yeast extracts that increse sense of flavor and increase sensibility to salt, reducing the need of salt in some degree, and reducing the need of extra fat. Not sure it they reduce enough to the point of allow tastefull flavor with low level of both. And I'm not sure about the price.


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Old 09-15-2019, 03:54 PM   #144 (permalink)
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To an extent they can replace sodium with potassium. You can buy "Light Salt" which is a combination of the two.
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Old 09-15-2019, 04:45 PM   #145 (permalink)
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Growing vegetables or meat expels cabonic acid. Creating life-precursor proteins will eventually be carbon negative. Currently 1/10th of vegetables and 1/100th of meat.

Protein from air and water will be a feedstock to lab grown meat.
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Old 09-15-2019, 08:19 PM   #146 (permalink)
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The taste it's different. You can replace some portion of sodium with potassium, but not all. I read a text about a yeast extract that reduced the key taste of potassium, allowing a highr portion of it with sodium. I supose if they could combine the use of this yeast extract, to allow more potassium, plus the yeast extract that enhance the taste of salts (sodium), they could reduce sodium quite expressively.

The fats are complex. Impossible Foods reduced the coconut oil (satured fat -not good for health) and added some sunflower oil (non satured fat-better for health), reducing the total amount of satured fat in Impossible Burger. But sunflower oild it's liquid in room temperature.
I don't kniow how they keep it in flakes, since the burger have flakes of solid oil to simulate fat on grill, and even the sound. Maybe a mix of coconut with a small proportion sunflower oil keep it still solid, or they tried someting else.

All oils that are solid in room temperature are bad for health, like coconut oil and palm oil, both rich in satured fats.
There is a process called hydrogenation, that make vegetal liquid oild became solid or near solid, but they also became as bad for health as pig fat. They are called trans fat.

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To an extent they can replace sodium with potassium. You can buy "Light Salt" which is a combination of the two.

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Old 09-15-2019, 08:37 PM   #147 (permalink)
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Well, thin air making food it's quite attractive as curiosity. But synthetic aminoacids are a reality in interesting prices, as production technologies got refined and more efficient. It don't need to be made from air, but the news about use CO2 it's attractive marketing to call attention.

There are studies showing the possibility of use synthetic aminoacids mixed with ration for birds, to lower the cost. They just add the essential aminoacids using synthetic aminoacids, while add no synthetic natural aminoacids, since they are not needed. I don't know if birds profile for essential aminooacids are equal or very similar to human needs. I presume humans needs to eat more kinds of aminoacids than birds, since birds can survive with just corn (I think).

And my personal opinion is that aminoacids, vitamins and energy (fat and carbohydrater and sugars) are not all we need. Plants have many more good things for us, and there are things we will probably find latter that are necessary to lower some risks of diseases.

And the more we became dependant of technology to survive, the more fragile we get. If a enemy would try to destroy a highly technology dependent society, they would just need to destroy energy supply, usines. And there is a atomic weapon that do just that, cut the energy without destroy cities, since it's detonated in high altitude.
And one giant solar flare could burn energy transformers in a entire side of Earth.

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Growing vegetables or meat expels cabonic acid. Creating life-precursor proteins will eventually be carbon negative. Currently 1/10th of vegetables and 1/100th of meat.

Protein from air and water will be a feedstock to lab grown meat.
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Old 09-15-2019, 08:49 PM   #148 (permalink)
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Another unhealthy thing that became fashion among vergans, and many brazilian vegans are using, it's the so caled liquid smoke, used to simulate the flavor of smoked meat. The problem it's that it's so unhealth as real smoked meat, since it's made by condensation of the smoke of burned wood, and so it's full of toxins.
There is no clean burn, since all burn of celulosis will generate toxins.

There is a yeast extract that tries to simulate smoked meat flavor, and I supose it's not toxic.
Yes, I talked a lot about yeast extract, since they can manipulate yeast extract to creat many different flavors and flavors enhancers.

Correctred. It was "burn"and nor "bur" as I said (type mistake)

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Old Yesterday, 02:08 PM   #149 (permalink)
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I was pondering the food ethics issues today.

What if we cultivated animals that wanted to be eaten?

What if cultivated animals that liked poor living conditions?
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Old Yesterday, 03:39 PM   #150 (permalink)
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Animals who wanted to be eaten??? Maybe you are talking about animals who walks in two feet.

Eat animals who live in poor condition??
Man... are talking about uncle Jordan (Peterson) all meat diet??? After all, right wing wants to eat the poors.

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I was pondering the food ethics issues today.

What if we cultivated animals that wanted to be eaten?

What if cultivated animals that liked poor living conditions?

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